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[Music]

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this hope radio for the masses headliner

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between July 8 1947 be on the air for

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professionals been applying there -

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found and is now in the possession of

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the RA the game is rigged changed the

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game changer I occasionally think how

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quickly our differences worldwide would

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vanish if we were facing an alien threat

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from outside his way

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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this is baby black with your host Jimmy

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church on the game changer radio network

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need your help to get to the year

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eighty-five

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[Music]

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you're listening to fade to black with

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well well well welcome fade to black

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yeah man how you doin today's Monday

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September 24 2018 270 days into the new

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year Jeff's 95 days left we are live

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from a bunker

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somewhere in the middle of

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downtown Burbank California and I would

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like to welcome everybody listening all

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around the world across the United

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States hither and thither to and fro

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back and forth up and down east and west

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north and south far and near

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this is fade to black for kjc are the

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game changer network and KCRA the planet

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I'm your host Jimmy Church what is rock

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and everybody how you do it Monday yeah

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you know what Rita and I did last night

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went over to our brothers house with

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night vision on the patio that's how you

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do it Benny breaking the family one at a

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saw something too

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that was someone's even better but

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anyway it's Monday back in the chair so

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good to be here with all of you got an

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amazing week lined up on fade to black

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and let's let's just go over that right

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now we move things around this week

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we're gonna do four shows in four nights

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while we always do four shows in four

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nights but we're doing four shows in

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four nights and what I mean by that is

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no fader night this week that's right we

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are doing four straight shows okay and

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so what we're gonna do this week tonight

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very excited we've been working on all

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of this for quite a while tonight Mitch

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Horowitz is here and we're gonna talk

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about his new work of the miracle club

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how thoughts become reality and we've

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got a lot of things to talk about with

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Mitch tonight and the book is just a

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part of it he's a very dynamic author

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and researcher and and a public speaker

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very cool guy and lots to do with Mitch

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and I'm gonna get all of it in tonight

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the best that I can so that's tonight

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tomorrow night John Greenwald is going

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to be here we're gonna talk about the

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recent documents on the Japan Airlines

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UFO incident and also a new document

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only one that has been released with

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Freedom of Information Act concerning a

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tip so that is tomorrow night big show

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tomorrow night with John Greenwald

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Wednesday night Julia mas Bridge is

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going to be here PhD and we're gonna

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talk about Precog and time travel with

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her new book the premonition code which

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I have here it's a it's a great book so

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that that's Wednesday and if that wasn't

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enough kids that wasn't enough Thursday

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night

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brace yourselves Dean Radin is here I

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have been wanting to have a conversation

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with Dean Radin for years finally

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Thursday night Dean Radin is on fade to

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black so how was that that is I tweeted

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it out tonight what an amazing week you

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got Mitch Horowitz John Greenwald the

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black vault

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Julia MA spurts and Dean Radin all in

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one week somebody pinch me I love my job

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so there you go no fader night this week

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but we're rewarding you with four shows

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four nights four amazing guests four

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four four all right all right

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I'm stellar you know what to do there

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I'm stellar calm I'm a big social media

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guy love social media I have my own

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personal relationship with social media

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how I deal with it and not deal with it

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but I've gone through it all I've gone

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through it all with a social media if

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anybody understands social media it is

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yours truly it's moi and going all the

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way back to to the first versions of AOL

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right and your friends chat box that

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will pop up

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remember that you'd sign on you'd listen

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to your modem and you'd wait for it to

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click over

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oh I connected screen would load and

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then your buddy what we buddy list yeah

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and today it's all evolved into one

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great place and that is on stellar

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dot-com the next great social media

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platform built for us built for this

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community on stellar comm so go hang out

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there during the show hang out at

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twitter @jj radio that's me at Jay

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Church radio hashtag f2 B is the sandbox

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hashtag f2b Q is fade to black questions

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you can follow Mitch Horowitz at Mitch

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Horowitz that's right and you'll know

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he's the right Mitch because he's got

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that spectacular blue checkmark right

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there he's verified yep right there in

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Twitter follow Mitch Facebook YouTube

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you know what to do okay everything is

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Jimmy Church fade to black and go find

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it follow like and subscribe over at the

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website you can also email me directly

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throughout the show Jimmy and Jimmy

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Church radio calm all of you special

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fader nots out there get your secret

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email to me and you know I see those

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first that's right I see those first or

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in the show wait wait wait wait wait

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Murph why did you post why did you post

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Princess Bride here it's not somebody's

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birthday that I didn't know about I need

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to know and Frankie where was this

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picture taken that's a pretty cool shot

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right there I dig that shirt where did

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you get that

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all right hashtag you have to beat

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that's the sandbox gonna be a few

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thousand tweets tonight posted right

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there from all of you and if you want to

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see what it's all about that's all you

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got to do follow me follow me follow me

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on twitter IG trattoria hashtag if to be

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come and hang out breaking news what a

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news day today today was one of those

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news days where I didn't read nothing

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you got the Department of Justice right

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China sanctions you got the next Supreme

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Court

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justice you got Facebook you got spies

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spies versus spies and so I jumped

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around today looking at these headlines

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this is what I did I jumped around so I

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went a little bit to Europe you know I

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went over to Asia went down South

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America a little bit Central America

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jumped around and looked at a Eva went

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to Hong Kong right that counts

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that's not Europe right that's that's

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Asia jumped over there and the headlines

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around the world are all covering the

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same things I just told you the China

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sanctions Department of Justice all the

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stuff and and and so I just thought what

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are they saying about this and it turns

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out that the news outlets around the

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world are covering the same news the

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same headlines but they don't have the

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same information some spin on it and

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it's really funny where do you go you

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know if you read the body of the news

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copy from each news source

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none of it says the same thing so which

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stories got it right which news outlet

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it doesn't matter the only thing that

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they did get right today that Bill Cosby

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didn't get sentenced his hearing

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continues tomorrow but one news headline

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that got through everything and you

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probably didn't read paleontologists in

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China have discovered a new species of

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fossil bird that they say reveals a

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pivotal point in the evolution of flight

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when birds had lost the long bony tail

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seen a dinosaurs like the Toronto Soros

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but before they had developed a fan of

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feathers on a shortened tail seen in

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flying birds today you should see the

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fossil it's amazing but the size of a

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modern crow the species had wide short

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wings and they probably just flew from

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tree to tree right but there you go you

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need

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check it out 127 million years old

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alright don't forget to subscribe to our

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podcast just $2 a month go to Jimmy

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Church radio calm you can do that right

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there you can also become a fader not

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over in our membership section simple

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enough to do just click and visit all of

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our sponsors all you have to do is click

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on the banners over Jimmy teachers radio

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comm go and visit our sponsors

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they've all been with us for such a long

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time the wall products that I stand

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behind it's that simple

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and that's how this show happens alright

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our dead guy's birthday today Jim Henson

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1936 to 1990 died so young at the age of

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53 and with the Muppets Henson changed

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the world but he sealed the deal with

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the movie labyrinth Jim if you're

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listening happy birthday on this day in

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history 2016 terrorists gunman attacks

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the pulse nightclub in Orlando Florida

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killing 49 people and at the same time

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at that time it was the deadliest mass

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shooting in modern US history but that

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status would change almost exactly a

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year later in Las Vegas on October 1st

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2017 Fader fact vetted Fader fact catnip

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catnip is 10 times more effective at

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repelling mosquitoes than DEET that's

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right

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DEET is the main and most commonly used

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ingredient in insect repellents scratch

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that stuff just rub catnip all over your

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body and you know what all the cats in

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the neighborhood are gonna love you too

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tonight very special guest Mitch

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Horowitz is here be with us at the

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bottom of the hour gonna talk about his

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new book The Miracle Club but not only

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that he covers just a little bit

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everything

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he's really good so the conversation is

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going to be very free flowing to my

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tonight tomorrow night

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John Greenwald is here we're gonna talk

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about the Japan Airlines UFO incident as

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well as the the latest and only document

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to be released in the Freedom of

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Information Act concerning a tip

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Wednesday night Julia Moss bridge is

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here we're going to talk about time

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travel and precognition her new book is

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called the premonition code Thursday

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night Dean Radin I can't believe it

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Dean Radin dr. Dean Radin PhD right here

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unfaded lack all right no fate or night

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this week we've got four shows four

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nights for guests and I would like to

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welcome back to fade to black right now

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the one the only

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Ronnie McMullen Ronnie good evening my

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friend how are you how you doing Jimmy

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it's great to hear your voice

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now yeah I did I did announced last week

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that a friend of ours and I'm referring

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to our fader not family the fade to

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black family that a friend of ours had a

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plane crash in his backyard and I didn't

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want to tell anybody who I don't want

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you to get bothered but Ronnie that was

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you how are you doing you know living

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00:14:29,029 --> 00:14:27,389
and breathing I mean it was tough it was

274
00:14:31,099 --> 00:14:29,039
I visualized the whole thing you know a

275
00:14:32,749 --> 00:14:31,109
lot of the articles will say uh other

276
00:14:34,789 --> 00:14:32,759
people weren't home and that's quite a

277
00:14:36,979 --> 00:14:34,799
lie and I loved it you know

278
00:14:39,979 --> 00:14:36,989
said the police you know right that's

279
00:14:42,799 --> 00:14:39,989
the first problem right there but you

280
00:14:47,539 --> 00:14:42,809
know it it's uh I just feel bad for the

281
00:14:50,629 --> 00:14:47,549
pilot it cost him his life and you know

282
00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:50,639
to see all the issues that went on was

283
00:14:55,069 --> 00:14:52,649
was tough it was really tough you just

284
00:14:57,919 --> 00:14:55,079
you kind of think you know I was telling

285
00:15:00,139 --> 00:14:57,929
somebody today you know I have I have a

286
00:15:02,409 --> 00:15:00,149
nice backyard that's kind of like my Zen

287
00:15:05,059 --> 00:15:02,419
area I've got trees and fruit trees and

288
00:15:08,239 --> 00:15:05,069
you know roses and it's just really

289
00:15:09,420 --> 00:15:08,249
beautiful fountain all that kind of

290
00:15:12,010 --> 00:15:09,430
stuff and

291
00:15:14,050 --> 00:15:12,020
you have an airplane crash in your

292
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:14,060
backyard and all of a sudden the word

293
00:15:17,230 --> 00:15:16,130
safe goes right out the window right of

294
00:15:26,140 --> 00:15:17,240
course of course

295
00:15:29,770 --> 00:15:26,150
well the pilots what happened he first

296
00:15:33,280 --> 00:15:29,780
of all the the engine quit and so he was

297
00:15:36,730 --> 00:15:33,290
dropping altitude quickly he topped my

298
00:15:39,460 --> 00:15:36,740
garage I've got a two-story garage he

299
00:15:41,380 --> 00:15:39,470
topped my garage took the tile off one

300
00:15:46,140 --> 00:15:41,390
end and that kind of tilted him to the

301
00:15:51,220 --> 00:15:46,150
left it put his running gear in my

302
00:15:56,380 --> 00:15:51,230
workout room and then he cart wheeled

303
00:15:59,050 --> 00:15:56,390
into my backyard so I when I was looking

304
00:16:00,340 --> 00:15:59,060
out the sliding glass window which you

305
00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:00,350
know I don't stand at the sliding glass

306
00:16:05,980 --> 00:16:02,090
window all day so it's just everything

307
00:16:07,630 --> 00:16:05,990
was very weird all I saw was this white

308
00:16:09,190 --> 00:16:07,640
that's all I saw because I was looking

309
00:16:12,820 --> 00:16:09,200
at the underbelly of the plane mm-hmm

310
00:16:14,260 --> 00:16:12,830
and it just was strange because you know

311
00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:14,270
ten minutes before that I was taking my

312
00:16:18,700 --> 00:16:17,330
dogs out to go do their business and I

313
00:16:21,820 --> 00:16:18,710
was standing the exact place that the

314
00:16:26,230 --> 00:16:21,830
plane landed ten minutes before you know

315
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:26,240
so timing is so incredible I was in the

316
00:16:31,510 --> 00:16:29,210
workout room 20 minutes before so just

317
00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:31,520
strange you know it makes you think

318
00:16:39,550 --> 00:16:35,330
about life and appreciate life well it

319
00:16:44,740 --> 00:16:39,560
does of course I talked to you right

320
00:16:47,650 --> 00:16:44,750
after the crash and you had told me that

321
00:16:52,630 --> 00:16:47,660
the pilot and we'll get to that part in

322
00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:52,640
a second but that the pilot was that the

323
00:16:55,900 --> 00:16:54,170
fire department the ambulance got there

324
00:16:57,460 --> 00:16:55,910
in about five minutes you said that that

325
00:17:01,360 --> 00:16:57,470
was just amazing they got there right

326
00:17:03,340 --> 00:17:01,370
away and then they evacuated the pilot

327
00:17:07,390 --> 00:17:03,350
and you didn't know the status of the

328
00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:07,400
pilot did he survived no excuse me he

329
00:17:16,090 --> 00:17:12,730
passed away 80% of his body was burned

330
00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:16,100
what I talked to in my back yard was

331
00:17:19,970 --> 00:17:17,570
probably adrenaline even though he was

332
00:17:23,660 --> 00:17:19,980
answering correctly

333
00:17:25,370 --> 00:17:23,670
and his words were I'm toast and I said

334
00:17:26,630 --> 00:17:25,380
no you're not and of course you know he

335
00:17:27,980 --> 00:17:26,640
didn't look good and I said no you're

336
00:17:29,150 --> 00:17:27,990
not and I said I gotta get you out of

337
00:17:31,310 --> 00:17:29,160
here because the plane at that point was

338
00:17:33,770 --> 00:17:31,320
on fire and it was about maybe ten feet

339
00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:33,780
away and I I was thinking if that

340
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:35,130
thing's empty of fuel because obviously

341
00:17:40,550 --> 00:17:37,650
it cruised in here on no motor if it's

342
00:17:42,230 --> 00:17:40,560
empty of fuel it's a bomb and you know I

343
00:17:44,690 --> 00:17:42,240
had it there it was it crashed right

344
00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:44,700
next to an outbuilding that I had it was

345
00:17:50,300 --> 00:17:48,210
you know all wood so if that exploded it

346
00:17:52,850 --> 00:17:50,310
would send wood bullets into who knows

347
00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:52,860
where so I was trying to get him and I

348
00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:54,930
said let me help you know you know and

349
00:17:57,910 --> 00:17:56,610
he goes please don't touch me how old

350
00:18:00,380 --> 00:17:57,920
was he

351
00:18:03,290 --> 00:18:00,390
seventy in fact I that was three days

352
00:18:07,700 --> 00:18:03,300
he'd be 71 so he was almost 71 years old

353
00:18:13,010 --> 00:18:07,710
and he was a fighter pilot

354
00:18:16,190 --> 00:18:13,020
he flew cargo 727s he was a flight

355
00:18:20,330 --> 00:18:16,200
instructor we're not talking this guy

356
00:18:22,940 --> 00:18:20,340
was a hero in you know everything he did

357
00:18:26,500 --> 00:18:22,950
and and a friend has came over my house

358
00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:26,510
a couple days later and I said you know

359
00:18:28,910 --> 00:18:28,530
you wouldn't happen to have a picture of

360
00:18:32,360 --> 00:18:28,920
him would you

361
00:18:33,980 --> 00:18:32,370
and he goes yeah he want a picture yeah

362
00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:33,990
I'll show you a picture so he showed me

363
00:18:39,470 --> 00:18:35,610
three one

364
00:18:43,850 --> 00:18:39,480
he's smiling ear-to-ear teaching his

365
00:18:45,140 --> 00:18:43,860
granddaughter to fly another one he's

366
00:18:47,990 --> 00:18:45,150
just looking at the camera cuz he's

367
00:18:51,050 --> 00:18:48,000
flying he's a smiley and another one

368
00:18:53,390 --> 00:18:51,060
when I saw all the pictures I thought he

369
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:53,400
was completely smiling so I've had a few

370
00:19:01,280 --> 00:18:55,290
people say well at least he died doing

371
00:19:05,090 --> 00:19:01,290
what he loved because he loved to fly he

372
00:19:09,260 --> 00:19:05,100
said he said that he was toast and I

373
00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:09,270
know that I mean there's two things that

374
00:19:17,750 --> 00:19:12,690
come into play there one you anybody is

375
00:19:20,030 --> 00:19:17,760
going to want to assist and and perform

376
00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:20,040
rescue and and and help somebody survive

377
00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:22,970
and then the other part of it is

378
00:19:28,070 --> 00:19:25,050
officially all of the emergency services

379
00:19:30,610 --> 00:19:28,080
tell you do not move anybody that's been

380
00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:30,620
in a crash that you could potentially

381
00:19:35,330 --> 00:19:33,250
harm more than they'll return

382
00:19:37,919 --> 00:19:35,340
yeah yeah so you're kind of stuck there

383
00:19:40,770 --> 00:19:37,929
me well you have to you have to preserve

384
00:19:42,450 --> 00:19:40,780
life though and for me like that's it

385
00:19:47,310 --> 00:19:42,460
he's not gonna be here I'm not going to

386
00:19:51,090 --> 00:19:47,320
be here if that plane blows up but when

387
00:19:52,260 --> 00:19:51,100
he said please don't touch me and he you

388
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:52,270
know and I thought it was interesting he

389
00:19:56,820 --> 00:19:53,770
didn't say don't touch me he said please

390
00:19:59,430 --> 00:19:56,830
don't touch me hmm and I thought how

391
00:20:01,710 --> 00:19:59,440
interesting you know you're doing

392
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:01,720
terrible and you have manners you know

393
00:20:04,020 --> 00:20:03,490
most people have no manners and they're

394
00:20:06,299 --> 00:20:04,030
fine

395
00:20:07,770 --> 00:20:06,309
yes that's weird right so he's like

396
00:20:11,039 --> 00:20:07,780
please don't touch me he said it twice

397
00:20:12,510 --> 00:20:11,049
and so I thought you know and like I

398
00:20:14,039 --> 00:20:12,520
said he didn't look good and so I was

399
00:20:18,149 --> 00:20:14,049
like you know I had to go see if there's

400
00:20:20,279 --> 00:20:18,159
any other dead body it was probably 10

401
00:20:23,010 --> 00:20:20,289
10 to 15 minutes 10 to 12 minutes maybe

402
00:20:24,510 --> 00:20:23,020
that the fire department showed up and

403
00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:24,520
the police officers they they stuck

404
00:20:30,810 --> 00:20:28,690
around and did nothing but the the fire

405
00:20:33,870 --> 00:20:30,820
department was top-notch and so was

406
00:20:36,049 --> 00:20:33,880
emergency people taking him away you

407
00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:36,059
have nothing but good to say about it

408
00:20:43,020 --> 00:20:41,110
true first responders in my opinion you

409
00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:43,030
know if you can't be a part of fixing it

410
00:20:47,190 --> 00:20:45,490
get the flip out of the way yeah I know

411
00:20:48,630 --> 00:20:47,200
we don't need six cops from who knows

412
00:20:50,340 --> 00:20:48,640
we're standing there with their arms

413
00:20:51,990 --> 00:20:50,350
fold and that's what I saw and it just

414
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:52,000
torqued me I was like you know I wanted

415
00:20:55,470 --> 00:20:53,530
to say get off my participant property

416
00:20:57,980 --> 00:20:55,480
get out of here but you know that

417
00:21:00,720 --> 00:20:57,990
probably wouldn't go over real well so

418
00:21:05,850 --> 00:21:00,730
but I it was it was it you know was a

419
00:21:07,980 --> 00:21:05,860
tough incident and I'm sorry you know

420
00:21:11,190 --> 00:21:07,990
that day because it happened about 10:30

421
00:21:15,330 --> 00:21:11,200
in the morning and that day I was asking

422
00:21:17,370 --> 00:21:15,340
God why this happened I mean you know

423
00:21:19,529 --> 00:21:17,380
you look at him I think we were talking

424
00:21:22,649 --> 00:21:19,539
unfair about the chances of having an

425
00:21:24,060 --> 00:21:22,659
airplane flying your back yards one in a

426
00:21:25,590 --> 00:21:24,070
million one in trillion one in a billion

427
00:21:28,409 --> 00:21:25,600
whatever the numbers are right but it's

428
00:21:31,169 --> 00:21:28,419
rare and I was asking God you know I

429
00:21:33,270 --> 00:21:31,179
don't take things like oh this is a

430
00:21:35,190 --> 00:21:33,280
coincidence or I don't take things for

431
00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:35,200
granted I just I think there's a message

432
00:21:39,630 --> 00:21:37,090
and everything that goes on so I was

433
00:21:40,980 --> 00:21:39,640
like what what are you saying god you're

434
00:21:43,020 --> 00:21:40,990
trying to tell me something because I

435
00:21:45,659 --> 00:21:43,030
could have been dead my workers out

436
00:21:47,169 --> 00:21:45,669
there could have been dead it could have

437
00:21:50,049 --> 00:21:47,179
been so much worse

438
00:21:54,239 --> 00:21:50,059
so what are you saying to me and and I

439
00:21:57,070 --> 00:21:54,249
just I I really felt this sense of

440
00:21:58,839 --> 00:21:57,080
knowing after I asked that and and it

441
00:22:01,509 --> 00:21:58,849
didn't come quick by the way hours

442
00:22:04,839 --> 00:22:01,519
afterwards almost like I needed to keep

443
00:22:07,209 --> 00:22:04,849
thinking about it but after X amount

444
00:22:11,109 --> 00:22:07,219
hours went by I just had this knowing

445
00:22:14,079 --> 00:22:11,119
that I felt like God said you need to

446
00:22:17,079 --> 00:22:14,089
celebrate life more with your friends

447
00:22:21,149 --> 00:22:17,089
and your family everyday because you

448
00:22:23,709 --> 00:22:21,159
don't know how short life is you know

449
00:22:24,940 --> 00:22:23,719
obviously you know who's who thinks

450
00:22:26,979 --> 00:22:24,950
they're gonna wake up and you know and

451
00:22:29,769 --> 00:22:26,989
be in their house you know and I making

452
00:22:31,810 --> 00:22:29,779
my phone call I wasn't doing my work and

453
00:22:33,459 --> 00:22:31,820
and all of a sudden mam you know here

454
00:22:35,049 --> 00:22:33,469
comes this planning and of course there

455
00:22:37,539 --> 00:22:35,059
was no motor because it had quit so it

456
00:22:41,379 --> 00:22:37,549
flew in quietly and just you know just

457
00:22:42,909 --> 00:22:41,389
so you don't know and we we get in the

458
00:22:44,769 --> 00:22:42,919
car every day oh let's go to in-n-out

459
00:22:46,180 --> 00:22:44,779
burger yeah you know we don't know

460
00:22:50,229 --> 00:22:46,190
what's gonna happen we won't come back

461
00:22:52,450 --> 00:22:50,239
that's right we need to enjoy our family

462
00:22:55,060 --> 00:22:52,460
and our friends and appreciate what's

463
00:22:57,729 --> 00:22:55,070
around us you know even our dog's our

464
00:22:59,799 --> 00:22:57,739
animals whatever we need to and that's

465
00:23:02,259 --> 00:22:59,809
that's kind of what I got Ronnie you're

466
00:23:06,479 --> 00:23:02,269
paying too much attention to this you

467
00:23:10,629 --> 00:23:06,489
need to pay attention to this mmm

468
00:23:15,690 --> 00:23:10,639
because all this over here means nothing

469
00:23:20,820 --> 00:23:15,700
and all this over here means everything

470
00:23:23,619 --> 00:23:20,830
you cannot go tell somebody that's gone

471
00:23:25,539 --> 00:23:23,629
what you think you need to tell them

472
00:23:28,419 --> 00:23:25,549
that yes so many people don't say hey I

473
00:23:30,549 --> 00:23:28,429
love you it do you know that you know

474
00:23:33,039 --> 00:23:30,559
and I I'll never forget when I told my

475
00:23:35,289 --> 00:23:33,049
best friend one day I said I needed you

476
00:23:38,079 --> 00:23:35,299
to know in case you know we were like 18

477
00:23:39,759 --> 00:23:38,089
19 years old I said I need to tell you

478
00:23:42,989 --> 00:23:39,769
something he goes what what's going on

479
00:23:45,549 --> 00:23:42,999
what will tell me and I said I love you

480
00:23:48,249 --> 00:23:45,559
and he's like you know made all these

481
00:23:51,009 --> 00:23:48,259
very directory' comments and I said no

482
00:23:52,299 --> 00:23:51,019
no no you're like a brother to me and I

483
00:23:54,339 --> 00:23:52,309
love you you need to know that in case

484
00:23:56,099 --> 00:23:54,349
anything ever happens you need to know

485
00:24:00,249 --> 00:23:56,109
that you need to know that in your soul

486
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:00,259
and he started crying and he goes man

487
00:24:02,290 --> 00:24:00,650
you get

488
00:24:04,450 --> 00:24:02,300
mushy on me I don't know how to do this

489
00:24:06,970 --> 00:24:04,460
I said I don't either but I know I

490
00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:06,980
appreciate you and I need you to know

491
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:10,130
that and you probably do but just in

492
00:24:13,990 --> 00:24:11,810
case it's good to hear it right all

493
00:24:16,300 --> 00:24:14,000
right and I think that's what his

494
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:16,310
brought out is you know I've held my

495
00:24:25,930 --> 00:24:17,090
grandsons

496
00:24:28,990 --> 00:24:25,940
since the crash and boy I hold him so I

497
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:29,000
think the message is so important and

498
00:24:34,690 --> 00:24:31,610
not only I mean the obvious is the

499
00:24:37,390 --> 00:24:34,700
obvious Ronnie which is you never know

500
00:24:39,250 --> 00:24:37,400
right life is too short you you wake up

501
00:24:41,470 --> 00:24:39,260
in the morning and you live it like it's

502
00:24:43,360 --> 00:24:41,480
your last day on earth man and you do

503
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:43,370
that every day we hear that over and

504
00:24:49,120 --> 00:24:45,890
over again and we get a little bit too

505
00:24:50,020 --> 00:24:49,130
used to that you know but when something

506
00:24:53,410 --> 00:24:50,030
like that

507
00:24:56,140 --> 00:24:53,420
instantly happens completely oh and when

508
00:24:58,600 --> 00:24:56,150
it does of course you're surprised

509
00:25:01,750 --> 00:24:58,610
because if you were expecting it then

510
00:25:04,360 --> 00:25:01,760
it's a different situation but we need

511
00:25:09,490 --> 00:25:04,370
to sometimes hear it from you and from

512
00:25:11,890 --> 00:25:09,500
our friends about how how how precious

513
00:25:16,990 --> 00:25:11,900
you know every second is I did it I did

514
00:25:21,460 --> 00:25:17,000
a thing Ronnie us as a few years ago but

515
00:25:24,670 --> 00:25:21,470
I started to look at how many days you

516
00:25:26,410 --> 00:25:24,680
live if you live to 70 right how many

517
00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:26,420
days is that and I would throw that

518
00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:28,730
question out to people and that

519
00:25:35,140 --> 00:25:31,370
everybody got it wrong the answer right

520
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:35,150
and then but you start to when you get

521
00:25:41,410 --> 00:25:38,690
up to a certain age 40 50 years old and

522
00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:41,420
now you're looking at a very finite

523
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:44,450
numbers if you make it to 70 or 80 right

524
00:25:52,330 --> 00:25:47,570
well then you start to realize not only

525
00:25:56,170 --> 00:25:52,340
our days precious but minutes minutes

526
00:25:59,380 --> 00:25:56,180
are precious and it's it's really really

527
00:26:00,880 --> 00:25:59,390
true and you don't want to be at some

528
00:26:04,300 --> 00:26:00,890
point in your life going you know what

529
00:26:07,690 --> 00:26:04,310
man I regret being a dick

530
00:26:11,830 --> 00:26:07,700
you know I regret being mean to that / I

531
00:26:14,330 --> 00:26:11,840
regret somebody needed 20 dollars and I

532
00:26:16,460 --> 00:26:14,340
would you know and I you know a

533
00:26:18,649 --> 00:26:16,470
it's all regretting one hand over that

534
00:26:20,870 --> 00:26:18,659
piece of paper that's right - oh right

535
00:26:23,899 --> 00:26:20,880
right right right I don't want to be

536
00:26:26,120 --> 00:26:23,909
that guy I just don't want to be that

537
00:26:28,700 --> 00:26:26,130
guy I don't want to live with any

538
00:26:31,430 --> 00:26:28,710
regrets man I I really don't and

539
00:26:37,010 --> 00:26:31,440
sometimes we need to be woken up and it

540
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:37,020
sounds like sounds like you had a moment

541
00:26:41,360 --> 00:26:38,970
of self-reflection with your grandson

542
00:26:43,700 --> 00:26:41,370
and your wife and you look around and go

543
00:26:46,779 --> 00:26:43,710
whoa you know and we need to hear that

544
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:46,789
Ronnie thank you for sharing that well

545
00:26:51,019 --> 00:26:50,250
yeah I'm just you know and I think about

546
00:26:53,060 --> 00:26:51,029
things

547
00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:53,070
you know it's kind of like I I carry a

548
00:26:57,320 --> 00:26:54,690
hundred dollar bill in my wallet all the

549
00:27:00,860 --> 00:26:57,330
time and the reason it's folded up in my

550
00:27:03,590 --> 00:27:00,870
wallet a special place and this started

551
00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:03,600
a couple years ago was when I see

552
00:27:09,019 --> 00:27:06,450
somebody in need that I was to give that

553
00:27:10,549 --> 00:27:09,029
hundred ollars no questions asked no you

554
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:10,559
know and when you give some you know

555
00:27:14,029 --> 00:27:11,610
hundred dollars to somebody you don't

556
00:27:15,350 --> 00:27:14,039
know you know sometimes it's tough

557
00:27:17,299 --> 00:27:15,360
because you're like oh well they might

558
00:27:19,039 --> 00:27:17,309
go out on drink they might go out you

559
00:27:21,980 --> 00:27:19,049
know we get very judgmental instead of

560
00:27:23,779 --> 00:27:21,990
just going here and so this has been

561
00:27:26,029 --> 00:27:23,789
kind of a training system for me as to

562
00:27:28,220 --> 00:27:26,039
and what's funny is you know it's not

563
00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:28,230
like you I do it every time I go out but

564
00:27:33,919 --> 00:27:30,000
like you know maybe a few months will go

565
00:27:37,310 --> 00:27:33,929
by I and I haven't done it and I'll feel

566
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:37,320
this inner voice a you're not looking

567
00:27:42,529 --> 00:27:40,890
hard enough so in other words there's

568
00:27:43,909 --> 00:27:42,539
need but I'm not paying attention -

569
00:27:46,159 --> 00:27:43,919
right right right right

570
00:27:47,779 --> 00:27:46,169
all right and it's not like oh my gosh

571
00:27:49,909 --> 00:27:47,789
you know and that's when I started then

572
00:27:52,010 --> 00:27:49,919
you start looking and then it you know

573
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:52,020
it's it's really a positive energy that

574
00:27:55,190 --> 00:27:53,970
when you do it I mean I could tell you

575
00:27:58,700 --> 00:27:55,200
stories and we won't go into that but

576
00:28:00,590 --> 00:27:58,710
it's just so it's a ghost it all goes

577
00:28:02,690 --> 00:28:00,600
together appreciating doing things for

578
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:02,700
other people you know and that's what

579
00:28:08,090 --> 00:28:05,730
makes us feel good you know is is is

580
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:08,100
being helped you know and real quickly

581
00:28:12,830 --> 00:28:09,330
you know had somebody come in my

582
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:12,840
backyard during the crash and they they

583
00:28:15,889 --> 00:28:14,250
were a nuisance they thought they were

584
00:28:18,230 --> 00:28:15,899
helping that King gave orders like they

585
00:28:20,630 --> 00:28:18,240
were some kind of police officer or fire

586
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:20,640
crew or whatever and everything you know

587
00:28:25,070 --> 00:28:22,770
he at one point get a blanket let's you

588
00:28:27,169 --> 00:28:25,080
know we'll wrap the guy you'll wrap the

589
00:28:28,310 --> 00:28:27,179
guy he's burnt it'll stick to him like

590
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:28,320
cellophane

591
00:28:34,010 --> 00:28:30,930
you know people if you don't know what

592
00:28:36,470 --> 00:28:34,020
you're doing don't act like you do mmm

593
00:28:37,850 --> 00:28:36,480
you know what I mean but as soon as the

594
00:28:40,130 --> 00:28:37,860
firefighters were there and I was

595
00:28:41,630 --> 00:28:40,140
backing out of the way get out of the

596
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:41,640
way let them do their thing they don't

597
00:28:46,580 --> 00:28:43,650
need me gawking and watching and no you

598
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:46,590
know so anyway but yeah it's it's

599
00:28:51,650 --> 00:28:49,170
interesting what hard times will bring

600
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:51,660
kind of brings you wisdom sometimes well

601
00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:54,690
that's why you have life change tea I

602
00:28:59,390 --> 00:28:56,610
mean you've always been out there doing

603
00:29:01,490 --> 00:28:59,400
just that helping others it's what

604
00:29:04,340 --> 00:29:01,500
you're about Ronnie and just thank you

605
00:29:07,460 --> 00:29:04,350
for that and and with that I want

606
00:29:10,130 --> 00:29:07,470
everybody to go and visit get the tea

607
00:29:12,860 --> 00:29:10,140
calm life change tea Ronnie's been with

608
00:29:14,870 --> 00:29:12,870
this show for such a long time one of

609
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:14,880
the great people on this planet Ronnie

610
00:29:20,090 --> 00:29:16,650
thank you so much my friend

611
00:29:21,950 --> 00:29:20,100
and don't ever change thank you I

612
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:21,960
appreciate it Jimmy Ronnie you're the

613
00:29:25,310 --> 00:29:23,850
best and I and I say it every every

614
00:29:27,260 --> 00:29:25,320
single time you're on the show but

615
00:29:30,740 --> 00:29:27,270
Ronnie you are the very best life

616
00:29:33,470 --> 00:29:30,750
changed he get the t.com head over there

617
00:29:36,470 --> 00:29:33,480
Ronnie is doing nothing but helping

618
00:29:36,740 --> 00:29:36,480
others it's what he does this is fade to

619
00:29:38,420 --> 00:29:36,750
black

620
00:29:40,310 --> 00:29:38,430
I'm your host Amy church that is Ronnie

621
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:40,320
McMullen I'm gonna get out of here when

622
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:42,690
I come back after this short break Mitch

623
00:29:51,470 --> 00:29:45,330
Horowitz is here stay with us

624
00:29:51,480 --> 00:30:24,169
[Music]

625
00:30:28,850 --> 00:30:26,659
this is Nicole Church daughter of

626
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you-know-who and you're listening to

627
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fade to black on Jimmy Church radio.com

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and the GameChanger network you're

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[Music]

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radio.com times are changing the circus

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of politics Healthcare's low standards

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and high prices and let's not forget

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food quality what to do arm yourself

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with life change t get that t-dot-com in

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a world of chemical imbalance and pour

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up on organic non-gmo supplements don't

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your best naturally all you have to do

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is log on to get to t.com that's get the

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that's get the t.com changing america's

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one tea bag at a time 9 out of 10

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geneticists agreed fade to black

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have struggled to reach their weight

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702
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this is Jimmy church and whatever your

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diet plans are do what I did go to fast

704
00:34:49,310 --> 00:34:31,310
what's up what open comments and we're

705
00:34:55,310 --> 00:34:51,169
all right welcome back paid the block

706
00:34:58,580 --> 00:34:55,320
I'm gonna hosting me church tonight

707
00:35:01,040 --> 00:34:58,590
Mitch Horowitz is here what a great week

708
00:35:02,690 --> 00:35:01,050
we have lined up on the show tomorrow

709
00:35:04,450 --> 00:35:02,700
night John Greenwald is gonna be here

710
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:04,460
from the black vault

711
00:35:11,150 --> 00:35:07,890
Wednesday night Julia Moss bridge ph.d

712
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:11,160
is gonna be here Thursday night Dean

713
00:35:16,970 --> 00:35:15,090
Radin PhD what a great week we've got

714
00:35:18,080 --> 00:35:16,980
lined up but tonight it's Mitch Horowitz

715
00:35:20,750 --> 00:35:18,090
I've been looking forward to this show

716
00:35:23,030 --> 00:35:20,760
for for quite a while he's a writer in

717
00:35:26,060 --> 00:35:23,040
residence at the New York Public Library

718
00:35:27,650 --> 00:35:26,070
pen award-winning author of books

719
00:35:30,020 --> 00:35:27,660
including a cult America we're gonna

720
00:35:32,390 --> 00:35:30,030
talk about that tonight one simple idea

721
00:35:35,870 --> 00:35:32,400
how positive thinking reshaped a modern

722
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:35,880
life mind as a builder and in his newest

723
00:35:41,330 --> 00:35:38,850
work is the miracle club how thoughts

724
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:41,340
become reality he has written on

725
00:35:45,530 --> 00:35:43,650
everything from the war on witches to

726
00:35:47,270 --> 00:35:45,540
the secret life of Ronald Reagan we're

727
00:35:48,980 --> 00:35:47,280
going to get to that tube as well today

728
00:35:50,900 --> 00:35:48,990
for the New York Times Wall Street

729
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:50,910
Journal the Washington Post a long time

730
00:35:56,090 --> 00:35:54,090
in Politico he has discussed alternative

731
00:35:58,340 --> 00:35:56,100
spirituality on CBS Sunday morning

732
00:36:00,560 --> 00:35:58,350
Dateline NBC CNN and throughout the

733
00:36:03,230 --> 00:36:00,570
national media he hosted the show's

734
00:36:06,110 --> 00:36:03,240
master's class and one simple idea on

735
00:36:10,220 --> 00:36:06,120
the new thought channel and his work has

736
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:10,230
been censored in China but of course it

737
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:11,850
has I'd like to welcome to fade to black

738
00:36:15,140 --> 00:36:12,930
for the first time

739
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:15,150
Mitch Horowitz Mitch good evening man

740
00:36:19,010 --> 00:36:17,130
how are you thank you man great to be

741
00:36:21,710 --> 00:36:19,020
here it's great to have you and before

742
00:36:24,230 --> 00:36:21,720
we move forward you get the first-time

743
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:24,240
guests disclaimer Mitch are you ready

744
00:36:31,220 --> 00:36:26,610
for that oh I've been waiting for this

745
00:36:34,490 --> 00:36:31,230
okay here we know it's just sitting on

746
00:36:35,900 --> 00:36:34,500
my couch having conversations as friends

747
00:36:37,850 --> 00:36:35,910
and where the conversation starts it

748
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:37,860
starts where it ends it ends but we're

749
00:36:40,970 --> 00:36:40,050
gonna lose friends alright there you go

750
00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:40,980
see that was painless

751
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:45,810
it was yeah a couple of things before we

752
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:48,530
get started

753
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:50,970
dessert I'm gonna get to personal

754
00:36:56,260 --> 00:36:53,130
questions out of the way and then we'll

755
00:37:00,590 --> 00:36:56,270
start with the fun you've got a look

756
00:37:02,720 --> 00:37:00,600
you've got an image right and and so

757
00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:02,730
it's it's it's one of Rabb

758
00:37:09,260 --> 00:37:06,890
right it's one of its certainly modern

759
00:37:12,710 --> 00:37:09,270
but you've got you've got to look in an

760
00:37:15,530 --> 00:37:12,720
image and then you are writing with

761
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:15,540
intellect doesn't it kind of clashes

762
00:37:23,089 --> 00:37:18,530
with the image but it works too as well

763
00:37:25,550 --> 00:37:23,099
where were you this way as a kid you

764
00:37:28,430 --> 00:37:25,560
know and then you've just you happen to

765
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:28,440
be a writer and a journalist today I was

766
00:37:32,900 --> 00:37:30,210
definitely that way as a kid you know I

767
00:37:34,819 --> 00:37:32,910
always experimented with different looks

768
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:34,829
the first time I'll never forget I was

769
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:36,930
growing up in the 1970s in Queens New

770
00:37:42,770 --> 00:37:39,690
York and the very first time I saw a

771
00:37:44,210 --> 00:37:42,780
picture of Elvis in his white jumpsuit I

772
00:37:46,310 --> 00:37:44,220
felt like I was looking at this

773
00:37:48,380 --> 00:37:46,320
mysterious Archangel it's like he

774
00:37:50,089 --> 00:37:48,390
stepped right out of the pages of The

775
00:37:51,770 --> 00:37:50,099
Secret Doctrine and he was a fan of

776
00:37:53,930 --> 00:37:51,780
Madame Blavatsky and he actually took

777
00:37:56,240 --> 00:37:53,940
some inspiration for his costume design

778
00:37:58,640 --> 00:37:56,250
from her and I just saw that and I

779
00:38:00,230 --> 00:37:58,650
thought yes and I liked everything about

780
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:00,240
him the leather and the jumpsuits and

781
00:38:03,980 --> 00:38:01,770
everything so ever since I was a kid I

782
00:38:07,059 --> 00:38:03,990
guess I always had a flair for the

783
00:38:09,950 --> 00:38:07,069
theatrical playing all of us okay and

784
00:38:13,339 --> 00:38:09,960
music what did you listen to growing up

785
00:38:18,140 --> 00:38:13,349
oh boy The Who The Clash and the Dead

786
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:18,150
Kennedys that was the Holy Trinity you

787
00:38:21,230 --> 00:38:20,010
know what that's all connected I can

788
00:38:23,780 --> 00:38:21,240
yeah I can go with that

789
00:38:26,660 --> 00:38:23,790
I thought you were gonna throw in the

790
00:38:29,809 --> 00:38:26,670
germs I was it might be a bit of a reach

791
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:29,819
but but yeah I see all of that in you

792
00:38:36,470 --> 00:38:34,650
and you need to sometimes how do I want

793
00:38:38,210 --> 00:38:36,480
to say this you got to push the envelope

794
00:38:40,670 --> 00:38:38,220
in your personal life growing up and

795
00:38:44,059 --> 00:38:40,680
test the waters a little bit and then

796
00:38:46,790 --> 00:38:44,069
yeah it teaches you a little bit about

797
00:38:50,089 --> 00:38:46,800
society as you go forward doesn't it I

798
00:38:51,530 --> 00:38:50,099
know so I was born under Mercury

799
00:38:54,980 --> 00:38:51,540
retrograde the cycle of Mercury

800
00:38:57,319 --> 00:38:54,990
retrograde and I'm told that when your

801
00:39:00,109 --> 00:38:57,329
birthday falls during that astrological

802
00:39:01,819 --> 00:39:00,119
cycle you get younger as you age in

803
00:39:04,970 --> 00:39:01,829
certain ways so I feel more like myself

804
00:39:08,329 --> 00:39:04,980
today at the age of 52 than I did at age

805
00:39:10,490 --> 00:39:08,339
22 honestly and so I have to hand that

806
00:39:12,980 --> 00:39:10,500
to Mercury retrograde what do you think

807
00:39:14,210 --> 00:39:12,990
when you're out doing public speaking or

808
00:39:14,790 --> 00:39:14,220
you're going to do a book signing or

809
00:39:16,620 --> 00:39:14,800
whatever you

810
00:39:17,850 --> 00:39:16,630
your thing you have those out there that

811
00:39:20,190 --> 00:39:17,860
know who you are

812
00:39:21,540 --> 00:39:20,200
and your image right but you've got

813
00:39:22,890 --> 00:39:21,550
people out there that maybe have read

814
00:39:24,930 --> 00:39:22,900
the book and they don't know they're

815
00:39:27,540 --> 00:39:24,940
invited by friends you get introduced

816
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:27,550
and then you hit the stage wearing you

817
00:39:33,750 --> 00:39:30,330
know Doc Martens and your sleeves you

818
00:39:35,790 --> 00:39:33,760
know I think I think very often people

819
00:39:38,460 --> 00:39:35,800
are relieved because we're so we're also

820
00:39:40,170 --> 00:39:38,470
tired of the whole Stuart Smalley look

821
00:39:43,500 --> 00:39:40,180
you know the New Age man wearing the

822
00:39:45,390 --> 00:39:43,510
beige sweater speaking in the saccharine

823
00:39:46,830 --> 00:39:45,400
softer tones you know I don't like

824
00:39:49,290 --> 00:39:46,840
anybody to feel that they have to be put

825
00:39:51,660 --> 00:39:49,300
into some kind of a box and I feel like

826
00:39:53,850 --> 00:39:51,670
New Age culture is on the brink of

827
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:53,860
caricature in itself maybe it past that

828
00:39:59,370 --> 00:39:56,650
brink you know several years ago and I

829
00:40:01,200 --> 00:39:59,380
think we should all be able to kind of

830
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:01,210
dialogue with one another without

831
00:40:04,020 --> 00:40:02,530
expecting that there's a certain

832
00:40:05,790 --> 00:40:04,030
cultural place that you're going to come

833
00:40:07,140 --> 00:40:05,800
from so you know very often people are

834
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:07,150
kind of relieved by it because I'm

835
00:40:11,850 --> 00:40:09,370
talking about some sort of mystical or

836
00:40:14,460 --> 00:40:11,860
spiritual topic people are so accustomed

837
00:40:16,950 --> 00:40:14,470
to the scent of frankincense in the air

838
00:40:18,780 --> 00:40:16,960
and somebody who's dressed like Stevie

839
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:18,790
Nicks no disrespect to Stevie Nicks

840
00:40:23,790 --> 00:40:21,370
who I love but you know we can go beyond

841
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:23,800
that we don't have to be wearing robes

842
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:25,570
and beads all the time and I think it's

843
00:40:30,390 --> 00:40:27,370
healthy to break out of that mold yeah

844
00:40:33,270 --> 00:40:30,400
you know those stereotypes even and

845
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:33,280
you're so right about that when you go

846
00:40:38,550 --> 00:40:36,610
out I speak at a lot of UFO conferences

847
00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:38,560
right and conspiracy conferences and I

848
00:40:44,430 --> 00:40:42,250
go out and the that stereotypes

849
00:40:47,180 --> 00:40:44,440
certainly and it was deserved from the

850
00:40:50,180 --> 00:40:47,190
from the Saudis and from the 80s of

851
00:40:52,950 --> 00:40:50,190
gray-haired older generations and that

852
00:40:54,870 --> 00:40:52,960
there there are no youngsters there they

853
00:40:57,330 --> 00:40:54,880
don't get today I go to these

854
00:41:01,830 --> 00:40:57,340
conferences and I have to say it's

855
00:41:05,310 --> 00:41:01,840
equally divided I've got my young fans

856
00:41:09,279 --> 00:41:05,320
and old fans but the genre itself I look

857
00:41:13,670 --> 00:41:09,289
out and I see throngs of

858
00:41:16,009 --> 00:41:13,680
an X Gen you know it's right there and I

859
00:41:18,339 --> 00:41:16,019
love it and they know more about ufology

860
00:41:21,079 --> 00:41:18,349
and history than I do

861
00:41:22,190 --> 00:41:21,089
definitely our culture is opening up you

862
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:22,200
know you're starting to see more

863
00:41:26,839 --> 00:41:23,970
dreadlocks you're starting to see more

864
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:26,849
leather you're starting to see more Doc

865
00:41:31,039 --> 00:41:28,890
Martens it's it's not just the same old

866
00:41:33,559 --> 00:41:31,049
crowd dressed in corduroys speaking in

867
00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:33,569
singsong new-age tones and I don't want

868
00:41:37,190 --> 00:41:34,890
to put too much emphasis on the outer

869
00:41:39,470 --> 00:41:37,200
because my feeling is you know people

870
00:41:40,970 --> 00:41:39,480
should just dress however they most feel

871
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:40,980
comfortable but it's nice to see the

872
00:41:47,660 --> 00:41:43,170
stereotype cracking up yeah that's right

873
00:41:51,049 --> 00:41:47,670
and not to harp on this but I have often

874
00:41:54,079 --> 00:41:51,059
said you know to the to the older crowd

875
00:41:56,900 --> 00:41:54,089
don't be intimidated go up and hang out

876
00:42:00,349 --> 00:41:56,910
with the kids absolutely you know they

877
00:42:01,839 --> 00:42:00,359
they want to talk to you too yes and you

878
00:42:05,089 --> 00:42:01,849
always find that you know the nicest

879
00:42:07,190 --> 00:42:05,099
brightest most capable kids you meet are

880
00:42:09,079 --> 00:42:07,200
kids who are into goth culture or are

881
00:42:11,359 --> 00:42:09,089
kids who have like a death metal look

882
00:42:13,279 --> 00:42:11,369
because they're the Seekers you know and

883
00:42:15,259 --> 00:42:13,289
they wear that as a uniform to kind of

884
00:42:16,849 --> 00:42:15,269
signal being Outsiders but it doesn't

885
00:42:18,470 --> 00:42:16,859
mean they're not approachable quite the

886
00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:18,480
opposite when I hear from parents who

887
00:42:21,609 --> 00:42:19,890
are concerned because their teens are

888
00:42:24,049 --> 00:42:21,619
getting into goth or death metal I

889
00:42:25,609 --> 00:42:24,059
congratulate them because those kids are

890
00:42:27,109 --> 00:42:25,619
there the Outsiders in the best sense

891
00:42:30,829 --> 00:42:27,119
they're the Seekers and I love them

892
00:42:34,249 --> 00:42:30,839
that's exactly right and now my second

893
00:42:37,999 --> 00:42:34,259
question before we get started I like

894
00:42:43,490 --> 00:42:38,009
the personal questions we absolutely we

895
00:42:45,410 --> 00:42:43,500
can is the acceptance of your subjects

896
00:42:51,109 --> 00:42:45,420
when you're talking about the occult or

897
00:42:52,370 --> 00:42:51,119
magic or new agey type of subjects but

898
00:42:55,130 --> 00:42:52,380
you're out there dealing with the

899
00:42:57,620 --> 00:42:55,140
mainstream media and you know book

900
00:42:59,509 --> 00:42:57,630
publisher that is standing behind you

901
00:43:01,640 --> 00:42:59,519
you're out there doing has the

902
00:43:04,579 --> 00:43:01,650
mainstream media changed are they

903
00:43:07,789 --> 00:43:04,589
starting to embrace some of these fringe

904
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:07,799
topics that were taboo in the past you

905
00:43:12,289 --> 00:43:09,450
know I'd have to give a guess it yes and

906
00:43:14,420 --> 00:43:12,299
no to that I mean to some extent we have

907
00:43:16,700 --> 00:43:14,430
seen certain breakthroughs the New York

908
00:43:19,069 --> 00:43:16,710
Times over the past year has reported

909
00:43:21,259 --> 00:43:19,079
more seriously on UFO phenomena than

910
00:43:22,170 --> 00:43:21,269
they have any time over the past decades

911
00:43:24,750 --> 00:43:22,180
so there have been

912
00:43:27,060 --> 00:43:24,760
certain openings what I will find is

913
00:43:29,070 --> 00:43:27,070
that if you can connect with mainstream

914
00:43:32,940 --> 00:43:29,080
media folks on things that they found

915
00:43:34,740 --> 00:43:32,950
fascinating when they were kids then you

916
00:43:36,780 --> 00:43:34,750
can find sort of a basis to dialogue

917
00:43:38,660 --> 00:43:36,790
with them every kid at one point or

918
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:38,670
another grew up with a fascination of

919
00:43:43,350 --> 00:43:41,530
around flying saucers or big brother or

920
00:43:45,240 --> 00:43:43,360
the Loch Ness monster or what were those

921
00:43:47,100 --> 00:43:45,250
what were those twigs cracking in the

922
00:43:48,420 --> 00:43:47,110
woods you know or something strange that

923
00:43:50,550 --> 00:43:48,430
happened to them when they were a kid I

924
00:43:53,250 --> 00:43:50,560
will find people who are hardcore

925
00:43:54,990 --> 00:43:53,260
mainstream people who will come up to me

926
00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:55,000
and tell me you know I'm I'm not into

927
00:43:59,520 --> 00:43:57,130
your subject matter at all but I do have

928
00:44:01,110 --> 00:43:59,530
to tell you about a time where I had

929
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:01,120
this clairvoyant dream and I'll start

930
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:02,530
talking to me about something that's

931
00:44:06,090 --> 00:44:04,450
more wild than anything I might have

932
00:44:08,940 --> 00:44:06,100
been speaking about from the podium so

933
00:44:10,740 --> 00:44:08,950
if you can catch people sort of out of

934
00:44:12,810 --> 00:44:10,750
uniform so to speak if you can catch

935
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:12,820
people and talk to them about something

936
00:44:17,100 --> 00:44:14,530
that enchanted them when they were a kid

937
00:44:19,470 --> 00:44:17,110
or just some very strange thing like a

938
00:44:21,240 --> 00:44:19,480
prophetic dream or an ESP experience

939
00:44:23,610 --> 00:44:21,250
that they had that they wanted this

940
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:23,620
close to someone they can open up to you

941
00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:25,450
but then when they get back to their

942
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:27,130
tribe and they gather around the water

943
00:44:31,110 --> 00:44:29,050
cooler Monday morning so to speak

944
00:44:33,270 --> 00:44:31,120
they'll deny at all there is still a

945
00:44:35,190 --> 00:44:33,280
pervasive cynicism that you also find

946
00:44:38,340 --> 00:44:35,200
within the mainstream media and I find

947
00:44:40,350 --> 00:44:38,350
that a real drag because I always will

948
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:40,360
reach this point when I'm talking to a

949
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:43,810
producer or a reporter or an NPR host or

950
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:45,010
somebody you would think of as being

951
00:44:50,250 --> 00:44:48,010
very mainstream where you know when we

952
00:44:52,650 --> 00:44:50,260
get off the sociological and we start to

953
00:44:54,270 --> 00:44:52,660
talk in terms of belief sometimes

954
00:44:56,070 --> 00:44:54,280
they'll get very uncomfortable because I

955
00:44:58,140 --> 00:44:56,080
do classify myself as a believing

956
00:45:00,180 --> 00:44:58,150
historian and lots of historians in fact

957
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:00,190
are believing historians they don't wear

958
00:45:03,630 --> 00:45:01,450
that label because they think it's

959
00:45:05,070 --> 00:45:03,640
compromising but I try to be open and

960
00:45:07,110 --> 00:45:05,080
honest with people that I'm also a

961
00:45:09,260 --> 00:45:07,120
personal Explorer with in the occult

962
00:45:11,550 --> 00:45:09,270
subject matter that I write about and

963
00:45:13,290 --> 00:45:11,560
they sometimes find that difficult to

964
00:45:15,930 --> 00:45:13,300
take you know that's that's a battle

965
00:45:18,210 --> 00:45:15,940
that that still has to be still has to

966
00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:18,220
be struggled with but again the irony is

967
00:45:22,970 --> 00:45:20,890
if you look at most religious histories

968
00:45:25,230 --> 00:45:22,980
for example coming out of Judaism

969
00:45:27,060 --> 00:45:25,240
Catholicism where the new religions like

970
00:45:29,460 --> 00:45:27,070
Mormonism or different branches of

971
00:45:33,090 --> 00:45:29,470
Protestant Protestantism almost always

972
00:45:34,980 --> 00:45:33,100
the individual historian is a congregant

973
00:45:35,640 --> 00:45:34,990
within the ranks of those faiths and if

974
00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:35,650
you press that

975
00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:37,690
person they would concede to you they

976
00:45:42,150 --> 00:45:40,170
are believing historian I volunteer that

977
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:42,160
because I want people to know where I'm

978
00:45:45,630 --> 00:45:44,170
coming from it just so happens that the

979
00:45:48,300 --> 00:45:45,640
material I'm dealing with is more

980
00:45:50,250 --> 00:45:48,310
outside or material but almost every

981
00:45:52,110 --> 00:45:50,260
historian is coming from some sort of a

982
00:45:54,450 --> 00:45:52,120
congregational perspective some sort of

983
00:45:55,470 --> 00:45:54,460
critical sympathy for his or her subject

984
00:45:58,230 --> 00:45:55,480
matter when they're writing about

985
00:45:59,370 --> 00:45:58,240
religion usually or not but that's a

986
00:46:01,470 --> 00:45:59,380
battle that's thought to be fought in

987
00:46:04,470 --> 00:46:01,480
the mainstream right right right and are

988
00:46:07,860 --> 00:46:04,480
you suggesting which I think it's kind

989
00:46:09,630 --> 00:46:07,870
of my belief that those outlets

990
00:46:11,910 --> 00:46:09,640
certainly like the New York Times or The

991
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:11,920
Washington Post or CNN or Fox when they

992
00:46:17,460 --> 00:46:15,010
suddenly start covering a subject like

993
00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:17,470
UFOs that they ridiculed you know cue

994
00:46:20,450 --> 00:46:19,930
the x-files music right in the past yes

995
00:46:23,970 --> 00:46:20,460
yeah

996
00:46:26,720 --> 00:46:23,980
suddenly taking it serious do you think

997
00:46:29,820 --> 00:46:26,730
that that is those journalists always

998
00:46:32,580 --> 00:46:29,830
believed in UFOs but now suddenly they

999
00:46:36,050 --> 00:46:32,590
have the opportunity to to come out of

1000
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:36,060
the closet if you will in some cases I I

1001
00:46:40,500 --> 00:46:38,170
definitely have met journalists in the

1002
00:46:42,780 --> 00:46:40,510
mainstream who are looking for an

1003
00:46:44,700 --> 00:46:42,790
opportunity where there's a first safe

1004
00:46:46,500 --> 00:46:44,710
zone to discuss this subject matter they

1005
00:46:48,810 --> 00:46:46,510
run a safe zone and if you can supply

1006
00:46:50,850 --> 00:46:48,820
them with that safe zone where they feel

1007
00:46:53,670 --> 00:46:50,860
like you know you come to the table with

1008
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:53,680
serious bona fides you're not gonna push

1009
00:46:57,630 --> 00:46:55,690
them you know out beyond the margins on

1010
00:46:59,970 --> 00:46:57,640
certain issues then they're willing to

1011
00:47:01,680 --> 00:46:59,980
disclose things but just the same the

1012
00:47:03,750 --> 00:47:01,690
mainstream can also slam closed the door

1013
00:47:05,340 --> 00:47:03,760
after the New York Times reported I

1014
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:05,350
thought very gallantly and very bravely

1015
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:07,810
on some of the Pentagon Air Force UFO

1016
00:47:13,290 --> 00:47:10,570
sightings that we have on video one of

1017
00:47:15,390 --> 00:47:13,300
their colonists rasta thwaite wrote a

1018
00:47:17,370 --> 00:47:15,400
column talking about how this is all

1019
00:47:20,130 --> 00:47:17,380
fantasy this is all unicorn land this

1020
00:47:23,430 --> 00:47:20,140
all fairy tale land and he cited the

1021
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:23,440
work to back up his point of view of one

1022
00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:25,930
of my intellectual heroes and a close

1023
00:47:30,090 --> 00:47:27,610
friend of mine Jacques Vallee the great

1024
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:30,100
UFO researcher UFO theorists and

1025
00:47:36,060 --> 00:47:33,370
actually jacque's theories on UFOs is

1026
00:47:37,740 --> 00:47:36,070
that they're interdimensional and you

1027
00:47:40,290 --> 00:47:37,750
know some of the things that that this

1028
00:47:42,420 --> 00:47:40,300
columnist was trying to sort of rundown

1029
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:42,430
about the far-out views that you find

1030
00:47:46,650 --> 00:47:44,530
with the ufology or the New Age culture

1031
00:47:48,060 --> 00:47:46,660
and you know he's quoting Jacques

1032
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:48,070
without having really fully read his

1033
00:47:51,450 --> 00:47:49,570
work and realizing that

1034
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:51,460
Jacque lends credence to all kinds of

1035
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:53,290
things that go beyond physicality that

1036
00:47:57,120 --> 00:47:55,450
we know and we understand so sometimes

1037
00:47:58,770 --> 00:47:57,130
the mainstream will crack open the door

1038
00:48:00,240 --> 00:47:58,780
but then they'll slam it or they'll

1039
00:48:02,400 --> 00:48:00,250
attempt to slam it closed just as

1040
00:48:04,170 --> 00:48:02,410
quickly on your fingers yeah Ross got it

1041
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:04,180
all wrong if he ever met to play the

1042
00:48:08,670 --> 00:48:06,010
rock yeah if he has a good shot yes

1043
00:48:10,710 --> 00:48:08,680
maybe but Elam in a week and right just

1044
00:48:12,540 --> 00:48:10,720
know the guy's work yeah you you meet

1045
00:48:16,380 --> 00:48:12,550
jock and you look in his eyes and you

1046
00:48:20,150 --> 00:48:16,390
realize that he is actually an et you

1047
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:20,160
know yeah that would change Ross the

1048
00:48:26,520 --> 00:48:24,850
French part right but you know jock and

1049
00:48:27,600 --> 00:48:26,530
Dean Radin who you're having on later

1050
00:48:29,610 --> 00:48:27,610
this week

1051
00:48:31,980 --> 00:48:29,620
they're two the greatest influences on

1052
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:31,990
me likewise Jeffrey krinkle the

1053
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:33,450
religious scholar at Rice University

1054
00:48:38,250 --> 00:48:36,130
people have just tremendous intellect

1055
00:48:39,930 --> 00:48:38,260
but there's an adventurousness about

1056
00:48:42,150 --> 00:48:39,940
them and they really know how to ask a

1057
00:48:44,550 --> 00:48:42,160
question and pursue it in a serious way

1058
00:48:46,500 --> 00:48:44,560
which is what I love I didn't know we

1059
00:48:48,870 --> 00:48:46,510
were gonna go off on a UFO tangent but

1060
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:48,880
since we're here and since you since

1061
00:48:54,930 --> 00:48:51,130
you're a New Yorker I have to ask you

1062
00:48:58,350 --> 00:48:54,940
this the the the New York Times is a

1063
00:49:00,450 --> 00:48:58,360
very influential paper has been for a

1064
00:49:03,870 --> 00:49:00,460
long time and that article that came out

1065
00:49:06,750 --> 00:49:03,880
on that Saturday December 16th 2017

1066
00:49:09,150 --> 00:49:06,760
how did New Yorkers take it well you

1067
00:49:12,150 --> 00:49:09,160
know there was a kind of amusement and

1068
00:49:15,090 --> 00:49:12,160
there was a I think almost a little bit

1069
00:49:17,130 --> 00:49:15,100
of a denial you know quite frankly it

1070
00:49:18,450 --> 00:49:17,140
wasn't as if you know making the rounds

1071
00:49:21,810 --> 00:49:18,460
with the cocktail parties people were

1072
00:49:25,050 --> 00:49:21,820
sucking goodbye was all of a sudden but

1073
00:49:26,820 --> 00:49:25,060
I do think that it was an opening of a

1074
00:49:28,620 --> 00:49:26,830
door that can't be closed again I mean

1075
00:49:30,510 --> 00:49:28,630
that reportage was serious reportage

1076
00:49:33,660 --> 00:49:30,520
there was no irony there was no winking

1077
00:49:35,070 --> 00:49:33,670
there was no smirking and I I do think

1078
00:49:37,500 --> 00:49:35,080
it opened the door you know people are

1079
00:49:39,810 --> 00:49:37,510
very slow to come around to these things

1080
00:49:41,190 --> 00:49:39,820
I mean you know all across the country

1081
00:49:42,420 --> 00:49:41,200
you know people are slow to come around

1082
00:49:44,340 --> 00:49:42,430
to these things we've made these

1083
00:49:46,290 --> 00:49:44,350
extraordinary discoveries just in our

1084
00:49:48,660 --> 00:49:46,300
generation that you know there could be

1085
00:49:51,270 --> 00:49:48,670
in fact almost certainly as water on the

1086
00:49:52,830 --> 00:49:51,280
planet Mars for example the 25 years ago

1087
00:49:56,310 --> 00:49:52,840
that would have sounded absurd and

1088
00:49:58,230 --> 00:49:56,320
people are slow to take on the gravity

1089
00:50:00,120 --> 00:49:58,240
of what that might mean that there might

1090
00:50:02,460 --> 00:50:00,130
that it might mean that within our own

1091
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:02,470
solar system there are conditions

1092
00:50:04,870 --> 00:50:03,290
conduce

1093
00:50:08,620 --> 00:50:04,880
to life within our very own solar system

1094
00:50:10,780 --> 00:50:08,630
you know it's it's it's almost like it's

1095
00:50:12,820 --> 00:50:10,790
uh pending of our conception of what it

1096
00:50:15,670 --> 00:50:12,830
means to be human but it's so uh pending

1097
00:50:18,370 --> 00:50:15,680
that it's slow to sort of take root so I

1098
00:50:20,230 --> 00:50:18,380
would say here in New York it's it was

1099
00:50:22,570 --> 00:50:20,240
noted but it's it's slow to take root

1100
00:50:24,490 --> 00:50:22,580
you know it's such there's such a

1101
00:50:26,050 --> 00:50:24,500
cultural glacier that has to be moved

1102
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:26,060
for people to come to terms with this

1103
00:50:33,190 --> 00:50:29,690
well you bring up Dean Radin and one of

1104
00:50:36,130 --> 00:50:33,200
the interesting things that Dean has

1105
00:50:37,660 --> 00:50:36,140
been out there forcing and him and his

1106
00:50:40,030 --> 00:50:37,670
colleagues there there are others he's

1107
00:50:44,530 --> 00:50:40,040
certainly not the only one but the the

1108
00:50:47,140 --> 00:50:44,540
science side of everything that society

1109
00:50:51,850 --> 00:50:47,150
and cultures have been talking about for

1110
00:50:56,490 --> 00:50:51,860
thousands of years right magic the other

1111
00:51:00,610 --> 00:50:56,500
side life after death things right yeah

1112
00:51:03,940 --> 00:51:00,620
and and suddenly science today is

1113
00:51:06,630 --> 00:51:03,950
backing up and and vindicating

1114
00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:06,640
everything that you talked about Mitch

1115
00:51:11,710 --> 00:51:09,290
everything that you write about yes and

1116
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:11,720
it our generation I really I really do

1117
00:51:16,690 --> 00:51:14,450
believe that that our generation is on a

1118
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:16,700
kind of precipice in the way that the

1119
00:51:22,140 --> 00:51:18,890
Victorians were standing on a precipice

1120
00:51:24,940 --> 00:51:22,150
when the theories of Darwin began to

1121
00:51:27,810 --> 00:51:24,950
take precedence in the culture and and

1122
00:51:29,770 --> 00:51:27,820
people it's not as if the Victorians

1123
00:51:31,450 --> 00:51:29,780
jettisoned their religious point of view

1124
00:51:34,150 --> 00:51:31,460
it's not as if the Victorians stopped

1125
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:34,160
believing in God not at all but they had

1126
00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:36,370
to see themselves as part of a natural

1127
00:51:41,590 --> 00:51:39,650
evolutionary process of life it changed

1128
00:51:42,850 --> 00:51:41,600
their perspective on life it changed

1129
00:51:44,910 --> 00:51:42,860
their perspective on what it meant to be

1130
00:51:48,100 --> 00:51:44,920
human and likewise in our generation

1131
00:51:50,470 --> 00:51:48,110
quantum physics studies into the placebo

1132
00:51:52,930 --> 00:51:50,480
response advances in psychical research

1133
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:52,940
the precognitive research that Dean

1134
00:51:58,300 --> 00:51:55,610
Radin and Daryl BEM and others are doing

1135
00:52:00,400 --> 00:51:58,310
it's going to challenge our conception

1136
00:52:02,500 --> 00:52:00,410
again of what it means to be human and

1137
00:52:04,750 --> 00:52:02,510
this time we're going to have to take a

1138
00:52:07,030 --> 00:52:04,760
second look and I think we are taking a

1139
00:52:09,340 --> 00:52:07,040
second look at what the mind really is

1140
00:52:11,130 --> 00:52:09,350
what thought really is because we were

1141
00:52:13,390 --> 00:52:11,140
raised to believe that thought is

1142
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:13,400
cognitive function and motor function

1143
00:52:17,019 --> 00:52:15,290
and that's it that's that's thought

1144
00:52:18,719 --> 00:52:17,029
thought is making lists and so

1145
00:52:21,729 --> 00:52:18,729
is reaching out for your cup of coffee

1146
00:52:24,729 --> 00:52:21,739
essentially and yes we can of course you

1147
00:52:26,559 --> 00:52:24,739
know bring to that complex analyses and

1148
00:52:28,839 --> 00:52:26,569
so forth but cognition and motor

1149
00:52:33,429 --> 00:52:28,849
function are what thinking is and when

1150
00:52:36,519 --> 00:52:33,439
the gray matter diseases then then

1151
00:52:38,679 --> 00:52:36,529
thought disappears like bubbles you know

1152
00:52:41,169 --> 00:52:38,689
in a glass of carbonated water it's all

1153
00:52:43,059 --> 00:52:41,179
gone but now we're coming to understand

1154
00:52:46,749 --> 00:52:43,069
that thought is extra physical that if

1155
00:52:49,539 --> 00:52:46,759
if we can marshal evidence for things

1156
00:52:52,419 --> 00:52:49,549
like precognition or thought

1157
00:52:55,479 --> 00:52:52,429
transference if we can ever and

1158
00:52:57,370 --> 00:52:55,489
continually deepen the mysteries of the

1159
00:52:59,439 --> 00:52:57,380
placebo response which is what we're

1160
00:53:02,969 --> 00:52:59,449
seeing in a field like neuroplasticity

1161
00:53:05,529 --> 00:53:02,979
we're literally seeing thought rewire

1162
00:53:07,479 --> 00:53:05,539
the neural pathways in the brain it's

1163
00:53:09,159 --> 00:53:07,489
it's literal mind over matter we're

1164
00:53:11,140 --> 00:53:09,169
starting to come to terms with the fact

1165
00:53:12,849 --> 00:53:11,150
that thought has an extra physical

1166
00:53:14,289 --> 00:53:12,859
dimension and the only people who are

1167
00:53:17,109 --> 00:53:14,299
denying that are people who just don't

1168
00:53:21,640 --> 00:53:17,119
know the scientific literature or who

1169
00:53:24,969 --> 00:53:21,650
claim to a point of view that fears that

1170
00:53:25,749 --> 00:53:24,979
line of thought as irrational which is a

1171
00:53:27,399 --> 00:53:25,759
huge mistake

1172
00:53:29,380 --> 00:53:27,409
because that line of thought is where

1173
00:53:33,819 --> 00:53:29,390
science is going the whole quantum field

1174
00:53:35,559 --> 00:53:33,829
is asking deepened questions about the

1175
00:53:36,549 --> 00:53:35,569
observer effect like nothing we've seen

1176
00:53:39,130 --> 00:53:36,559
in 80 years

1177
00:53:41,289 --> 00:53:39,140
and our generation is going to come to

1178
00:53:43,029 --> 00:53:41,299
terms with the fact that there's an

1179
00:53:45,189 --> 00:53:43,039
extra physical dimension to thought and

1180
00:53:46,630 --> 00:53:45,199
that's what figures like like Dean Radin

1181
00:53:49,779 --> 00:53:46,640
and others are doing that's what they're

1182
00:53:53,169 --> 00:53:49,789
opening up I find it fascinating when I

1183
00:53:55,419 --> 00:53:53,179
hear somebody go dude I can't believe

1184
00:53:58,149 --> 00:53:55,429
you just called me I've been thinking

1185
00:54:04,299 --> 00:53:58,159
about you that's amazing but I don't

1186
00:54:06,999 --> 00:54:04,309
believe in ghosts it's like dude if you

1187
00:54:10,839 --> 00:54:07,009
can come to terms with the fact that we

1188
00:54:12,999 --> 00:54:10,849
have we have evidence we have clinically

1189
00:54:15,729 --> 00:54:13,009
gathered statistical evidence let's see

1190
00:54:17,169 --> 00:54:15,739
that validates yesterday if you can come

1191
00:54:19,059 --> 00:54:17,179
to terms with the implications of that

1192
00:54:21,929 --> 00:54:19,069
it does mean that the mind is extra

1193
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:21,939
physical it does mean that life is not

1194
00:54:26,709 --> 00:54:24,890
confined to these flesh and blood bodies

1195
00:54:30,039 --> 00:54:26,719
that we occupy for a short period of

1196
00:54:30,670 --> 00:54:30,049
time now what can be extrapolated from

1197
00:54:35,110 --> 00:54:30,680
that

1198
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:35,120
like we're on our knees just peeking

1199
00:54:38,890 --> 00:54:36,650
through a keyhole you know we're just at

1200
00:54:40,660 --> 00:54:38,900
the beginning of all this but once

1201
00:54:43,540 --> 00:54:40,670
you've come to terms with the fact that

1202
00:54:45,250 --> 00:54:43,550
there's an extra physical dimension of

1203
00:54:46,870 --> 00:54:45,260
mind or at least that there seems to be

1204
00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:46,880
and that we've gathered not only

1205
00:54:51,130 --> 00:54:49,130
testimony but evidence statistical

1206
00:54:53,590 --> 00:54:51,140
evidence to that effect specifically

1207
00:54:56,050 --> 00:54:53,600
involving precognition experiments among

1208
00:54:58,150 --> 00:54:56,060
other things it just opens up everything

1209
00:55:00,760 --> 00:54:58,160
it opens up a vista unto everything I

1210
00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:00,770
mean it's proof that humanity is not

1211
00:55:05,910 --> 00:55:03,410
just bound to physical forms where that

1212
00:55:08,290 --> 00:55:05,920
can take you is almost limitless but

1213
00:55:10,660 --> 00:55:08,300
shame on us if we fail to ask the

1214
00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:10,670
questions yeah it's it's it's amazing to

1215
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:12,770
me where you can have somebody that is

1216
00:55:18,130 --> 00:55:16,010
absolutely closed down about life in

1217
00:55:19,420 --> 00:55:18,140
that there's no life after there's

1218
00:55:21,430 --> 00:55:19,430
nothing there's nothing out in the

1219
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:21,440
universe there's no reason to dream I'm

1220
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:23,930
just gonna work pay for my car insurance

1221
00:55:29,290 --> 00:55:27,050
and then I die right it's just like you

1222
00:55:31,570 --> 00:55:29,300
know they don't have any first off

1223
00:55:33,940 --> 00:55:31,580
that's boring but you can't they have

1224
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:33,950
evidence all around them all day long

1225
00:55:38,470 --> 00:55:36,050
that there's much more to life but they

1226
00:55:40,540 --> 00:55:38,480
choose to ignore it if they choose to

1227
00:55:42,430 --> 00:55:40,550
ignore it and the materialists are just

1228
00:55:43,990 --> 00:55:42,440
wrong you know it can be stated that

1229
00:55:46,030 --> 00:55:44,000
plainly there's a materialist

1230
00:55:47,620 --> 00:55:46,040
philosopher who likes to use the

1231
00:55:50,380 --> 00:55:47,630
expression that human beings are nothing

1232
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:50,390
other than moist robots and he's wrong

1233
00:55:54,460 --> 00:55:52,490
he's wrong because the fact is we have

1234
00:55:56,350 --> 00:55:54,470
evidence right now that's been gathered

1235
00:55:58,420 --> 00:55:56,360
over the past decades just to say one

1236
00:56:00,760 --> 00:55:58,430
small area of research

1237
00:56:02,440 --> 00:56:00,770
leaving aside quantum physics and

1238
00:56:04,420 --> 00:56:02,450
psychical research and everything that

1239
00:56:07,110 --> 00:56:04,430
may be controversial or controversial in

1240
00:56:09,580 --> 00:56:07,120
its interpretation the field of nearest

1241
00:56:12,370 --> 00:56:09,590
neuroplasticity demonstrates in and of

1242
00:56:14,170 --> 00:56:12,380
itself that thoughts change neural

1243
00:56:16,660 --> 00:56:14,180
pathways in the brain that you're

1244
00:56:19,090 --> 00:56:16,670
witnessing literally mind over matter

1245
00:56:20,380 --> 00:56:19,100
thought is altering gray matter well

1246
00:56:22,240 --> 00:56:20,390
there's no such evidence for that

1247
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:22,250
happening in a machine there's no such

1248
00:56:26,890 --> 00:56:24,170
evidence for that happening in a robot

1249
00:56:30,190 --> 00:56:26,900
there may be some day but right now we

1250
00:56:33,270 --> 00:56:30,200
don't have a program that runs through a

1251
00:56:36,430 --> 00:56:33,280
computer that allows the computer to

1252
00:56:39,190 --> 00:56:36,440
intrinsically evolve a different

1253
00:56:40,900 --> 00:56:39,200
hardware from within itself organically

1254
00:56:42,580 --> 00:56:40,910
it may be able to assemble these things

1255
00:56:45,550 --> 00:56:42,590
of course but that's motor function

1256
00:56:47,950 --> 00:56:45,560
that's different that's not an evolution

1257
00:56:50,740 --> 00:56:47,960
phenomena that's a plane from within the

1258
00:56:52,900 --> 00:56:50,750
machine motor function is different we

1259
00:56:54,850 --> 00:56:52,910
see thought actually leading to

1260
00:56:56,710 --> 00:56:54,860
evolutionary phenomena within the brain

1261
00:56:59,020 --> 00:56:56,720
if I can use that term to describe an

1262
00:57:01,420 --> 00:56:59,030
alteration of the brains neural pathways

1263
00:57:03,100 --> 00:57:01,430
so we're not moist robots and that's

1264
00:57:04,720 --> 00:57:03,110
just citing one example that's already

1265
00:57:07,330 --> 00:57:04,730
ten years old at this point there's many

1266
00:57:08,560 --> 00:57:07,340
others materialism just doesn't hold up

1267
00:57:10,630 --> 00:57:08,570
in the 21st century

1268
00:57:12,460 --> 00:57:10,640
the other part we've got to take a break

1269
00:57:14,620 --> 00:57:12,470
right here and the other part about this

1270
00:57:19,210 --> 00:57:14,630
that I would suggest to anybody that has

1271
00:57:21,640 --> 00:57:19,220
doubts the main focus for DARPA and for

1272
00:57:23,620 --> 00:57:21,650
Sandia right now are to make those

1273
00:57:25,360 --> 00:57:23,630
conscious connections to computers that

1274
00:57:27,430 --> 00:57:25,370
I mean that's their focus

1275
00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:27,440
let's test let's take a break right here

1276
00:57:31,810 --> 00:57:29,810
Mitch when we come back I'm gonna go

1277
00:57:34,150 --> 00:57:31,820
straight at you I want to know how much

1278
00:57:37,030 --> 00:57:34,160
you're using your mind to change your

1279
00:57:40,140 --> 00:57:37,040
life don't do that when we come back I

1280
00:57:42,310 --> 00:57:40,150
guess right Mitch Horowitz his new book

1281
00:57:44,730 --> 00:57:42,320
came we're going to be discussing that

1282
00:57:48,580 --> 00:57:44,740
tonight too as well and the thing is

1283
00:57:49,990 --> 00:57:48,590
it's a cult America one of the things I

1284
00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:50,000
talk about on the show all the time

1285
00:57:53,350 --> 00:57:51,770
tonight I've got Mitch here I cannot

1286
00:57:55,450 --> 00:57:53,360
wait for this state to block our meal

1287
00:57:58,090 --> 00:57:55,460
Timmy Church follow Mitch on Twitter at

1288
00:58:09,020 --> 00:57:58,100
Mitch Horowitz you can follow me to at

1289
00:58:13,020 --> 00:58:11,100
this is fade to black

1290
00:58:16,710 --> 00:58:13,030
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

1291
00:58:18,500 --> 00:58:16,720
radio network and kgr a the global radio

1292
00:58:21,810 --> 00:58:18,510
alliance

1293
00:58:25,140 --> 00:58:21,820
this is kera digital broadcasting

1294
00:58:28,320 --> 00:58:25,150
station Salt Lake City Utah Van Buren

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00:58:30,830 --> 00:58:28,330
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ray sobs here repping the planet and

1318
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you're listening to my good friend Jimmy

1319
00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:39,760
Church fade to black on the game changer

1320
00:59:46,830 --> 00:59:42,610
network and the kgr a digital broadcast

1321
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station this is Toby Kebbell you're

1322
01:00:01,520 --> 00:59:49,500
listening to Jimmy Church radio calm

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01:00:50,010 --> 01:00:48,040
Jimmy Church radio.com hey it's grace

1341
01:00:52,589 --> 01:00:50,020
can we talk about something serious for

1342
01:00:54,839 --> 01:00:52,599
a minute your age getting old has its

1343
01:00:57,150 --> 01:00:54,849
perks but remember being a few years

1344
01:00:59,339 --> 01:00:57,160
younger you know your hair was thicker

1345
01:01:01,349 --> 01:00:59,349
you didn't have so many wrinkles that

1346
01:01:03,540 --> 01:01:01,359
extra weight wasn't haunting you and you

1347
01:01:05,880 --> 01:01:03,550
just felt better well we can't turn back

1348
01:01:08,609 --> 01:01:05,890
the clocks and go back 10 or 15 years

1349
01:01:10,950 --> 01:01:08,619
but you can start feeling and looking 10

1350
01:01:13,560 --> 01:01:10,960
or 15 years younger with nature's youth

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01:01:15,089 --> 01:01:13,570
RSF it's a doctor formulated daily

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01:01:17,220 --> 01:01:15,099
supplement that helps your body maintain

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01:01:19,980 --> 01:01:17,230
its peak performance and fight the aging

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01:01:21,450 --> 01:01:19,990
process imagine sleeping better looking

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01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:21,460
better and feeling better

1356
01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:24,010
see how Nature's youth RSF has helped

1357
01:01:28,589 --> 01:01:25,930
thousands of people just like you at

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1359
01:01:32,310 --> 01:01:30,760
imagine how old feel when your family

1360
01:01:34,440 --> 01:01:32,320
and friends are asking you what you did

1361
01:01:37,020 --> 01:01:34,450
to look so good your secret will be

1362
01:01:39,270 --> 01:01:37,030
nature's youth RSS it's time to start

1363
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:39,280
looking better and feeling better learn

1364
01:01:43,620 --> 01:01:41,410
more in order your nature's use RSS at

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01:01:46,770 --> 01:01:43,630
nature's youth calm that's nature's

1366
01:01:48,839 --> 01:01:46,780
youth calm that's nature's youth calm

1367
01:01:51,570 --> 01:01:48,849
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

1368
01:01:54,480 --> 01:01:51,580
and I only use night vision goggles from

1369
01:01:57,359 --> 01:01:54,490
baring optics you can see your very own

1370
01:02:00,710 --> 01:01:57,369
green chrome balls today by clicking on

1371
01:02:03,510 --> 01:02:00,720
their banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

1372
01:02:05,220 --> 01:02:03,520
this is my tanks of the graylien report

1373
01:02:07,320 --> 01:02:05,230
and you're listening to jimmy church on

1374
01:02:09,390 --> 01:02:07,330
fade to black across the globe on the

1375
01:02:10,350 --> 01:02:09,400
game-changer radio network and the one

1376
01:02:12,370 --> 01:02:10,360
and only Kate

1377
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:12,380
GRA radio the planet

1378
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:32,200
[Music]

1379
01:02:37,430 --> 01:02:34,770
all right welcome back fade to black I'm

1380
01:02:40,550 --> 01:02:37,440
you'll see me Church Twitter is on fire

1381
01:02:43,100 --> 01:02:40,560
tonight I kind of expected this come

1382
01:02:45,920 --> 01:02:43,110
follow me on twitter @jj radio hashtag f

1383
01:02:52,160 --> 01:02:45,930
to B is the sandbox follow Mitch at

1384
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:52,170
Mitch Horowitz very simple now very

1385
01:02:55,490 --> 01:02:54,570
simple Mitch you're gonna be out here in

1386
01:02:58,880 --> 01:02:55,500
Los Angeles

1387
01:03:00,620 --> 01:02:58,890
can't wait can't wait what are the dates

1388
01:03:03,020 --> 01:03:00,630
and where you gonna be I'm gonna be

1389
01:03:05,270 --> 01:03:03,030
speaking at the philosophical Research

1390
01:03:07,730 --> 01:03:05,280
Society in Griffin Park for dates

1391
01:03:10,520 --> 01:03:07,740
they're actually five dates there it's a

1392
01:03:12,620 --> 01:03:10,530
whirlwind I'm arriving on the 24th I'm

1393
01:03:15,710 --> 01:03:12,630
staying through the 28th of October

1394
01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:15,720
October 24th through 28th if you visit

1395
01:03:20,210 --> 01:03:17,690
me on Twitter you can find all the dates

1396
01:03:21,920 --> 01:03:20,220
I'm giving a couple of talks that are

1397
01:03:24,320 --> 01:03:21,930
free couple of talks that are ticketed

1398
01:03:26,150 --> 01:03:24,330
it's gonna be a lot of fun speaking

1399
01:03:28,520 --> 01:03:26,160
about manly Pete Hall speaking about the

1400
01:03:30,230 --> 01:03:28,530
history the occult speaking about my new

1401
01:03:32,330 --> 01:03:30,240
book the miracle Club last time I was

1402
01:03:35,570 --> 01:03:32,340
there a few months ago I just had an

1403
01:03:38,090 --> 01:03:35,580
absolute blast I love LA it's one of my

1404
01:03:41,420 --> 01:03:38,100
favorite places on earth and so I'll be

1405
01:03:42,980 --> 01:03:41,430
there starting on the 24th you can find

1406
01:03:46,310 --> 01:03:42,990
me in Griffith Park and camping out

1407
01:03:48,740 --> 01:03:46,320
there at the University of philosophical

1408
01:03:50,060 --> 01:03:48,750
research manly halls headquarters visit

1409
01:03:51,860 --> 01:03:50,070
me on Twitter you'll find the dates

1410
01:03:54,490 --> 01:03:51,870
right at the top of my page we'll be

1411
01:04:00,620 --> 01:03:54,500
there I can't wait what size t-shirt Oh

1412
01:04:04,910 --> 01:04:00,630
large please thank you there you go yeah

1413
01:04:09,020 --> 01:04:04,920
I gotta do that and see our shirts fit

1414
01:04:12,560 --> 01:04:09,030
your style you'll be you'll be you'll be

1415
01:04:15,680 --> 01:04:12,570
on pitch let me okay so one of the

1416
01:04:18,950 --> 01:04:15,690
things that I love to discuss because

1417
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:18,960
I've seen that own changes that I've had

1418
01:04:25,610 --> 01:04:22,290
in my life when it comes to putting your

1419
01:04:28,610 --> 01:04:25,620
mind to something and and trying your

1420
01:04:32,420 --> 01:04:28,620
best to find your bliss and change your

1421
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:32,430
reality yet and and and now that's what

1422
01:04:36,980 --> 01:04:34,410
the new book is about which is great and

1423
01:04:39,350 --> 01:04:36,990
I have it and the book is amazing but do

1424
01:04:42,170 --> 01:04:39,360
you apply this in your own life and what

1425
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:42,180
kind of changes have you seen Oprah sure

1426
01:04:45,800 --> 01:04:44,370
I do apply it and I always make a point

1427
01:04:49,700 --> 01:04:45,810
of telling people that

1428
01:04:53,450 --> 01:04:49,710
I'm now 52 years old I did not watch

1429
01:04:58,100 --> 01:04:53,460
wait wait wait wait wait you're not 52 I

1430
01:05:05,120 --> 01:04:58,110
am okay all right let's go but I don't

1431
01:05:09,140 --> 01:05:05,130
sleep I so you're gonna miss oh man

1432
01:05:11,330 --> 01:05:09,150
somehow I pulled through Wow okay I

1433
01:05:15,230 --> 01:05:11,340
didn't publish my first books until I

1434
01:05:16,670 --> 01:05:15,240
was I was in my 40s and you know people

1435
01:05:18,110 --> 01:05:16,680
could say well yeah but you know you

1436
01:05:19,700 --> 01:05:18,120
were hanging around publishing you were

1437
01:05:21,800 --> 01:05:19,710
kind of getting primed for it and yes

1438
01:05:25,010 --> 01:05:21,810
and oh yes and no you know I went into

1439
01:05:27,770 --> 01:05:25,020
publishing because I had stopped writing

1440
01:05:30,950 --> 01:05:27,780
you know my career as a writer I felt

1441
01:05:33,020 --> 01:05:30,960
hit a dead end went nowhere and I

1442
01:05:36,620 --> 01:05:33,030
entered publishing specifically because

1443
01:05:39,350 --> 01:05:36,630
I was looking for a job as a guy who had

1444
01:05:41,540 --> 01:05:39,360
left writing behind and I kind of made

1445
01:05:43,670 --> 01:05:41,550
peace with it throughout my 30s as you

1446
01:05:47,120 --> 01:05:43,680
do you know you sort of push things down

1447
01:05:49,040 --> 01:05:47,130
and you say gee I'm not sure if I really

1448
01:05:50,540 --> 01:05:49,050
stand for anything but you know your

1449
01:05:52,430 --> 01:05:50,550
spouse or your girlfriend or your

1450
01:05:55,280 --> 01:05:52,440
boyfriend if they're a good partner says

1451
01:05:56,270 --> 01:05:55,290
no no you're fine you're fine and you

1452
01:05:58,640 --> 01:05:56,280
know you could find a way of making

1453
01:06:00,980 --> 01:05:58,650
peace with mediocrity in a certain sense

1454
01:06:03,650 --> 01:06:00,990
which is really what I always doing

1455
01:06:06,230 --> 01:06:03,660
throughout much of my 30s but I could

1456
01:06:08,660 --> 01:06:06,240
never leave behind the wish to write and

1457
01:06:10,610 --> 01:06:08,670
the wish to sort of be in front of the

1458
01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:10,620
camera or in front of the microphone you

1459
01:06:13,820 --> 01:06:11,970
know rather than just facilitating

1460
01:06:15,410 --> 01:06:13,830
somebody else's work which is really a

1461
01:06:18,260 --> 01:06:15,420
great deal of what you do frankly when

1462
01:06:20,510 --> 01:06:18,270
you're in publishing and I found my way

1463
01:06:25,490 --> 01:06:20,520
back to writing through a strange series

1464
01:06:27,560 --> 01:06:25,500
of coincidences and breaks and I I found

1465
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:27,570
my purpose as a writer which was to

1466
01:06:32,930 --> 01:06:29,490
document metaphysical experience I

1467
01:06:34,700 --> 01:06:32,940
realized in my late 30s early 40s that

1468
01:06:36,380 --> 01:06:34,710
that's what I had been missing that's

1469
01:06:38,600 --> 01:06:36,390
the sense of mission that I had been

1470
01:06:40,070 --> 01:06:38,610
missing and I write about this in the

1471
01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:40,080
vertical club in fact I have an article

1472
01:06:44,060 --> 01:06:42,570
at medium.com called how quitting

1473
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:44,070
writing made me a writer you know I

1474
01:06:49,940 --> 01:06:46,650
didn't have that sense of mission but I

1475
01:06:53,540 --> 01:06:49,950
used my mind's faculties I was searching

1476
01:06:56,030 --> 01:06:53,550
in a very active determined committed

1477
01:06:58,370 --> 01:06:56,040
way I had a mental picture of where I

1478
01:06:59,390 --> 01:06:58,380
wanted to go and the events unfolded in

1479
01:07:02,749 --> 01:06:59,400
ways that I never

1480
01:07:04,370 --> 01:07:02,759
ever could have foreseen and it so

1481
01:07:06,829 --> 01:07:04,380
happened that it wasn't until I hit

1482
01:07:08,420 --> 01:07:06,839
middle age that I really found my way in

1483
01:07:10,700 --> 01:07:08,430
my voice as a writer and I attribute

1484
01:07:12,349 --> 01:07:10,710
that to the the program of mine

1485
01:07:15,109 --> 01:07:12,359
metaphysics that are right about in the

1486
01:07:17,599 --> 01:07:15,119
miracle club it happened for me and I

1487
01:07:20,150 --> 01:07:17,609
use it every day I use it every day I

1488
01:07:21,950 --> 01:07:20,160
have my failures because I've never

1489
01:07:24,769 --> 01:07:21,960
suffered from depression but I suffer

1490
01:07:26,269 --> 01:07:24,779
from anxiety and that's what got me into

1491
01:07:28,099 --> 01:07:26,279
the whole mind metaphysics field to

1492
01:07:31,220 --> 01:07:28,109
begin with I thought you know there has

1493
01:07:33,620 --> 01:07:31,230
to be a way of using my own faculties to

1494
01:07:35,569 --> 01:07:33,630
try to turn this around and I have to

1495
01:07:37,999 --> 01:07:35,579
say you know I say this to you friend to

1496
01:07:39,710 --> 01:07:38,009
friend that made all the difference in

1497
01:07:42,950 --> 01:07:39,720
my life it made all the difference in my

1498
01:07:44,390 --> 01:07:42,960
life because I if you and I had been

1499
01:07:48,140 --> 01:07:44,400
having this conversation when I was age

1500
01:07:50,210 --> 01:07:48,150
35 I could not have foreseen the books

1501
01:07:51,380 --> 01:07:50,220
and the articles and the appearances and

1502
01:07:53,450 --> 01:07:51,390
the other things that would have flowed

1503
01:07:55,640 --> 01:07:53,460
out of me and that's the program that I

1504
01:07:58,339 --> 01:07:55,650
write about in Miracle Club was there

1505
01:08:01,789 --> 01:07:58,349
one moment you know one thing that you

1506
01:08:04,220 --> 01:08:01,799
could look back now and go that was that

1507
01:08:07,519 --> 01:08:04,230
was the Epiphany well here this is the

1508
01:08:10,009 --> 01:08:07,529
moment this is the moment friends of

1509
01:08:11,859 --> 01:08:10,019
mine were running the magazine science

1510
01:08:14,479 --> 01:08:11,869
of mind which is an old positive

1511
01:08:16,640 --> 01:08:14,489
thinking monthly magazine that goes back

1512
01:08:20,140 --> 01:08:16,650
to the 1920s oh I read a column for it

1513
01:08:22,490 --> 01:08:20,150
today it's still with us and they

1514
01:08:24,379 --> 01:08:22,500
discuss back many years they got an

1515
01:08:27,079 --> 01:08:24,389
interview with the major league baseball

1516
01:08:29,559 --> 01:08:27,089
pitcher Barry Zito and Barry at the time

1517
01:08:33,379 --> 01:08:29,569
was pitching for the Oakland A's and

1518
01:08:35,149 --> 01:08:33,389
Barry grew up on this mind metaphysics

1519
01:08:39,200 --> 01:08:35,159
material his parents were very into it

1520
01:08:40,789 --> 01:08:39,210
they they imbued him with it and he used

1521
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:40,799
it as an intimate part of his own

1522
01:08:44,419 --> 01:08:42,810
training regimen and so they got an

1523
01:08:46,220 --> 01:08:44,429
interview with Barry and this was a very

1524
01:08:47,990 --> 01:08:46,230
big get and they didn't want to blow it

1525
01:08:49,249 --> 01:08:48,000
and they saw me as somebody who they

1526
01:08:50,930 --> 01:08:49,259
could trust and they came to me and

1527
01:08:52,729 --> 01:08:50,940
asked me if I would interview Barry and

1528
01:08:54,979 --> 01:08:52,739
write a profile of him and I said very

1529
01:08:56,689 --> 01:08:54,989
much yes you know I would I was thinking

1530
01:08:58,849 --> 01:08:56,699
to do it although I hadn't picked up a

1531
01:09:00,979 --> 01:08:58,859
pen for 10 years I had not picked up a

1532
01:09:03,649 --> 01:09:00,989
pen other than to read promo copy or

1533
01:09:05,149 --> 01:09:03,659
catalog copy for 10 years so I threw

1534
01:09:07,399 --> 01:09:05,159
myself into this with a real sense of

1535
01:09:08,539 --> 01:09:07,409
mission I wrote the profile I was happy

1536
01:09:10,939 --> 01:09:08,549
with that I was pleased with it it's

1537
01:09:12,260 --> 01:09:10,949
online it's called Barry's way anybody

1538
01:09:13,009 --> 01:09:12,270
wants to can throw that into Google

1539
01:09:15,109 --> 01:09:13,019
they'll fly

1540
01:09:19,459 --> 01:09:15,119
about two weeks after the thing was

1541
01:09:22,999 --> 01:09:19,469
published this was in October of 2003 I

1542
01:09:26,089 --> 01:09:23,009
got a call out of the blue from Barry's

1543
01:09:29,660 --> 01:09:26,099
father Joe Zito I had never met Joe

1544
01:09:31,759 --> 01:09:29,670
before in my life and he had this very

1545
01:09:33,890 --> 01:09:31,769
deep drill-sergeant kind of voice and he

1546
01:09:36,620 --> 01:09:33,900
said to me bish this article was

1547
01:09:39,439 --> 01:09:36,630
terrific now you listen to me you stick

1548
01:09:40,999 --> 01:09:39,449
with this thing and buy this thing he

1549
01:09:43,849 --> 01:09:41,009
meant writing about metaphysical

1550
01:09:45,739 --> 01:09:43,859
experience though he had never met me he

1551
01:09:48,109 --> 01:09:45,749
got what I was after he understood what

1552
01:09:50,299 --> 01:09:48,119
I was after and Barry later told me that

1553
01:09:54,169 --> 01:09:50,309
Joe had played that role in several

1554
01:09:55,939 --> 01:09:54,179
people's lives he died in 2013 but Joe

1555
01:09:57,500 --> 01:09:55,949
Zito Barry's father who I had never met

1556
01:09:59,450 --> 01:09:57,510
called me out of the blue he said I'll

1557
01:10:01,759 --> 01:09:59,460
never forget his words you stick with

1558
01:10:03,020 --> 01:10:01,769
this thing and it was confirmation to me

1559
01:10:05,899 --> 01:10:03,030
that was a green light that I was on the

1560
01:10:09,049 --> 01:10:05,909
right path that was an epiphany now what

1561
01:10:11,899 --> 01:10:09,059
about the the other side of all of this

1562
01:10:15,709 --> 01:10:11,909
which you know when we're talking about

1563
01:10:19,459 --> 01:10:15,719
taro or hermeticism or Ouija boards

1564
01:10:22,669 --> 01:10:19,469
occult history this is for most people a

1565
01:10:25,580 --> 01:10:22,679
life's journey of knowledge and and

1566
01:10:28,160 --> 01:10:25,590
truth seeking yep did did you have that

1567
01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:28,170
growing up or did all of this come much

1568
01:10:32,629 --> 01:10:31,170
later in in in year 40s it was both I

1569
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:32,639
had it growing up when I was a kid

1570
01:10:37,879 --> 01:10:35,690
growing up I was interested in UFOs and

1571
01:10:39,830 --> 01:10:37,889
astrology and was really hungry to know

1572
01:10:42,379 --> 01:10:39,840
where all these ideas came from I was

1573
01:10:46,220 --> 01:10:42,389
very interested in folklore and

1574
01:10:48,649 --> 01:10:46,230
mythology and then when I entered my 20s

1575
01:10:52,129 --> 01:10:48,659
my 30s I grew distant from it somewhat I

1576
01:10:54,080 --> 01:10:52,139
got more into politics but I grew really

1577
01:10:55,370 --> 01:10:54,090
tired of politics in the sense that I

1578
01:10:57,169 --> 01:10:55,380
felt as if I didn't have anything

1579
01:10:58,549 --> 01:10:57,179
original to add you know I mean

1580
01:11:01,339 --> 01:10:58,559
especially here in New York City

1581
01:11:03,109 --> 01:11:01,349
everybody's into politics and New York

1582
01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:03,119
did not need another guy bopping around

1583
01:11:06,410 --> 01:11:05,010
writing book reviews for the Village

1584
01:11:08,930 --> 01:11:06,420
Voice you know that just was not

1585
01:11:11,270 --> 01:11:08,940
something that our culture was calling

1586
01:11:13,399 --> 01:11:11,280
for and I felt sort of lost you know I

1587
01:11:15,049 --> 01:11:13,409
felt like I was just a guy you know one

1588
01:11:20,390 --> 01:11:15,059
more animal and a barnyard full of

1589
01:11:23,989 --> 01:11:20,400
animals and then I I was fired I was

1590
01:11:26,089 --> 01:11:23,999
fired from a political publishing house

1591
01:11:28,879 --> 01:11:26,099
and I was looking around

1592
01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:28,889
for jobs at new publishing houses and

1593
01:11:33,919 --> 01:11:31,650
end newspapers and stuff and I got a lot

1594
01:11:36,140 --> 01:11:33,929
of wonderful interviews I mean you

1595
01:11:38,629 --> 01:11:36,150
wouldn't believe the interviews that I

1596
01:11:40,850 --> 01:11:38,639
got I was speaking with John Kennedy jr.

1597
01:11:43,040 --> 01:11:40,860
at George magazine and magazine he was

1598
01:11:44,720 --> 01:11:43,050
launching I was speaking with Lewis

1599
01:11:46,370 --> 01:11:44,730
Lapham at Harper's Magazine I was

1600
01:11:48,050 --> 01:11:46,380
speaking with the chief executive editor

1601
01:11:50,390 --> 01:11:48,060
at the New York Times but these things

1602
01:11:52,100 --> 01:11:50,400
all amounted to almost they were all

1603
01:11:54,140 --> 01:11:52,110
these almost I wasn't getting anywhere

1604
01:11:56,089 --> 01:11:54,150
you know I would get to the second third

1605
01:11:58,129 --> 01:11:56,099
fourth interview but the job wouldn't

1606
01:12:00,020 --> 01:11:58,139
happen and I thought to myself I gotta

1607
01:12:02,660 --> 01:12:00,030
take stock of things here man you know I

1608
01:12:04,580 --> 01:12:02,670
can't live on almost and so I was

1609
01:12:06,350 --> 01:12:04,590
offered a job by a New Age publishing

1610
01:12:08,629 --> 01:12:06,360
house which was at that time called

1611
01:12:10,700 --> 01:12:08,639
Jeremy P charger or later came to me

1612
01:12:13,640 --> 01:12:10,710
noticed Archer penguin and they opened

1613
01:12:15,350 --> 01:12:13,650
the door for me and I said yes and my

1614
01:12:16,850 --> 01:12:15,360
friends thought I was crazy they thought

1615
01:12:19,550 --> 01:12:16,860
you know are you a lunatic you know it's

1616
01:12:21,919 --> 01:12:19,560
like your your your your your kind of

1617
01:12:24,530 --> 01:12:21,929
going from the world of literary

1618
01:12:26,180 --> 01:12:24,540
journalism and heightened publishing to

1619
01:12:26,870 --> 01:12:26,190
this new-age backwater and they thought

1620
01:12:28,939 --> 01:12:26,880
I was nuts

1621
01:12:30,229 --> 01:12:28,949
but I had a feeling that it would be the

1622
01:12:32,930 --> 01:12:30,239
right thing and I feel that when

1623
01:12:34,970 --> 01:12:32,940
somebody gives you a yes you should take

1624
01:12:37,399 --> 01:12:34,980
that very very seriously it's like

1625
01:12:39,979 --> 01:12:37,409
somebody extending a gift to you you

1626
01:12:42,229 --> 01:12:39,989
accept it and so I accepted it and I

1627
01:12:44,060 --> 01:12:42,239
went there and I found myself you know I

1628
01:12:46,100 --> 01:12:44,070
found my voice as a writer I found what

1629
01:12:48,260 --> 01:12:46,110
I needed to be working on I discovered

1630
01:12:52,010 --> 01:12:48,270
the kinds of metaphysical books on that

1631
01:12:54,260 --> 01:12:52,020
back list that brought me back to what I

1632
01:12:56,149 --> 01:12:54,270
was passionate about when I was a kid

1633
01:12:59,899 --> 01:12:56,159
and I never looked back I spent 20 years

1634
01:13:01,609 --> 01:12:59,909
there it defined my life Manley P Hall

1635
01:13:03,589 --> 01:13:01,619
I'm gonna jump into this I've got a

1636
01:13:06,770 --> 01:13:03,599
bunch of I'm sure you're watching

1637
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:06,780
Twitter right now and there's a lot of

1638
01:13:10,550 --> 01:13:08,730
questions that are backing up there and

1639
01:13:13,459 --> 01:13:10,560
I promise everybody I'll get to some of

1640
01:13:15,919 --> 01:13:13,469
them but Manley P Hall and when he get

1641
01:13:18,140 --> 01:13:15,929
her to go through this journey and you

1642
01:13:19,910 --> 01:13:18,150
get in to Manley P halls not only

1643
01:13:23,959 --> 01:13:19,920
writing but his public speaking was

1644
01:13:28,069 --> 01:13:23,969
absolutely extraordinary yeah how did

1645
01:13:29,810 --> 01:13:28,079
that man have it oh he was I mean he's

1646
01:13:32,359 --> 01:13:29,820
just one of the greatest influences on

1647
01:13:33,740 --> 01:13:32,369
me you know Manley Hall I didn't

1648
01:13:35,990 --> 01:13:33,750
discover him till I was a little bit

1649
01:13:38,839 --> 01:13:36,000
older I mean he was already several

1650
01:13:39,980 --> 01:13:38,849
years gone when I discovered him but

1651
01:13:41,540 --> 01:13:39,990
when I did it

1652
01:13:44,630 --> 01:13:41,550
was like falling into this rabbit hole

1653
01:13:47,780 --> 01:13:44,640
of discovery because there was a there

1654
01:13:51,080 --> 01:13:47,790
were a handful of people who convinced

1655
01:13:53,860 --> 01:13:51,090
me that you could pursue studies into

1656
01:13:56,270 --> 01:13:53,870
the occult with a deep intellectual

1657
01:13:59,270 --> 01:13:56,280
gravity and that was the influence that

1658
01:14:02,060 --> 01:13:59,280
Manley Hall had on my life and as it

1659
01:14:04,280 --> 01:14:02,070
happens the first public talk that I

1660
01:14:06,050 --> 01:14:04,290
ever gave was called the occult

1661
01:14:08,120 --> 01:14:06,060
philosophy in American life and it was

1662
01:14:10,520 --> 01:14:08,130
at Manly Hall's headquarters where I'm

1663
01:14:12,920 --> 01:14:10,530
returning to next month that was in 2005

1664
01:14:14,540 --> 01:14:12,930
and here's another thing about you know

1665
01:14:17,450 --> 01:14:14,550
when somebody offers you a gift you

1666
01:14:19,760 --> 01:14:17,460
accept it the head of of manlius

1667
01:14:21,470 --> 01:14:19,770
organization at that time said to me

1668
01:14:24,530 --> 01:14:21,480
listen if you're ever in the

1669
01:14:26,960 --> 01:14:24,540
neighborhood our stage our podium is

1670
01:14:27,950 --> 01:14:26,970
open to you and I said okay well I'm

1671
01:14:29,150 --> 01:14:27,960
gonna be in the neighborhood in

1672
01:14:31,730 --> 01:14:29,160
September you know I didn't have any

1673
01:14:33,560 --> 01:14:31,740
plans to be in LA but I thought I will

1674
01:14:35,720 --> 01:14:33,570
get a ticket I will go out there on my

1675
01:14:37,790 --> 01:14:35,730
own dime because I knew it was gonna be

1676
01:14:39,890 --> 01:14:37,800
a transformative experience and I felt a

1677
01:14:41,540 --> 01:14:39,900
gift was being extended to me and I

1678
01:14:43,130 --> 01:14:41,550
accepted it and I went there and I gave

1679
01:14:45,770 --> 01:14:43,140
this talk the occult philosophy in

1680
01:14:48,140 --> 01:14:45,780
American life that was in fall of 2005

1681
01:14:51,320 --> 01:14:48,150
two years after the phone call with Joe

1682
01:14:53,270 --> 01:14:51,330
Zito and that that talk became my first

1683
01:14:55,040 --> 01:14:53,280
book occult America it changed

1684
01:14:57,410 --> 01:14:55,050
everything for me Manley Hall and his

1685
01:15:01,070 --> 01:14:57,420
institutions have changed everything for

1686
01:15:04,070 --> 01:15:01,080
me Lord where did the I speculated on

1687
01:15:06,170 --> 01:15:04,080
this so much because quite frankly he

1688
01:15:07,670 --> 01:15:06,180
freaks me out his intelligence the way

1689
01:15:11,780 --> 01:15:07,680
that he speaks the way that he writes

1690
01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:11,790
yeah and the knots or extraordin sane

1691
01:15:17,920 --> 01:15:13,650
when you think about how complex that

1692
01:15:20,570 --> 01:15:17,930
man was yeah where did he get it dad

1693
01:15:20,780 --> 01:15:20,580
yeah I don't that's where'd he get it

1694
01:15:27,290 --> 01:15:20,790
from

1695
01:15:29,120 --> 01:15:27,300
I don't know he was not an ordinary man

1696
01:15:31,820 --> 01:15:29,130
you know it's it's funny as we speak I'm

1697
01:15:33,950 --> 01:15:31,830
holding a copy in my hands of the secret

1698
01:15:36,590 --> 01:15:33,960
teachings of all ages and I'm holding a

1699
01:15:39,050 --> 01:15:36,600
replica of the original edition this guy

1700
01:15:45,050 --> 01:15:39,060
was 27 years old when he published this

1701
01:15:48,260 --> 01:15:45,060
book 27 years old and I mean I cannot

1702
01:15:50,150 --> 01:15:48,270
say enough on this books behalf the

1703
01:15:52,310 --> 01:15:50,160
secret teachings of all ages and and I

1704
01:15:53,390 --> 01:15:52,320
have I've read the book in its entirety

1705
01:15:56,750 --> 01:15:53,400
it's

1706
01:15:59,030 --> 01:15:56,760
passages on Pythagorean mathematics or

1707
01:16:01,250 --> 01:15:59,040
approach mysteries mythology the

1708
01:16:03,919 --> 01:16:01,260
esotericism of the Shakespeare dramas

1709
01:16:06,050 --> 01:16:03,929
any single chapter would be worthy of a

1710
01:16:07,399 --> 01:16:06,060
lifetime of study any single chapter and

1711
01:16:10,100 --> 01:16:07,409
you would think it was some ancient

1712
01:16:11,930 --> 01:16:10,110
English bibliophile writing it you know

1713
01:16:14,990 --> 01:16:11,940
some guy 90 years old and or a

1714
01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:15,000
compilation of authors right right yes

1715
01:16:21,800 --> 01:16:19,530
this was a kid death of 27 years who

1716
01:16:23,600 --> 01:16:21,810
never really had formal education he

1717
01:16:25,970 --> 01:16:23,610
grew up in the Dakotas he popped around

1718
01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:25,980
the West as as as a kid

1719
01:16:29,630 --> 01:16:27,810
his grandmother briefly enrolled him in

1720
01:16:31,550 --> 01:16:29,640
a Military Academy here in New York City

1721
01:16:32,750 --> 01:16:31,560
where I live where he started writing

1722
01:16:35,030 --> 01:16:32,760
the book and then he popped out to

1723
01:16:36,770 --> 01:16:35,040
California but he didn't have a

1724
01:16:40,520 --> 01:16:36,780
university degree he had very little

1725
01:16:42,770 --> 01:16:40,530
formal schooling he he he visited public

1726
01:16:45,790 --> 01:16:42,780
libraries and the US and Great Britain

1727
01:16:48,500 --> 01:16:45,800
there's almost no cracking the code of

1728
01:16:51,830 --> 01:16:48,510
where Manley got all this information

1729
01:16:54,770 --> 01:16:51,840
from it it just was extraordinary IIIi

1730
01:16:57,530 --> 01:16:54,780
mean any terms that we could come up

1731
01:16:59,930 --> 01:16:57,540
with would be insufficient and he was

1732
01:17:02,810 --> 01:16:59,940
touched by something and he was he was

1733
01:17:04,399 --> 01:17:02,820
not an ordinary man no I look back in

1734
01:17:06,680 --> 01:17:04,409
and I ask anybody

1735
01:17:09,740 --> 01:17:06,690
look back to when you were 25 years old

1736
01:17:11,810 --> 01:17:09,750
where were we I was barely figuring out

1737
01:17:15,290 --> 01:17:11,820
how to intimated a guitar with a boss

1738
01:17:17,630 --> 01:17:15,300
tuner okay yeah that's where I was I was

1739
01:17:21,890 --> 01:17:17,640
trying to find precision bearings for my

1740
01:17:23,479 --> 01:17:21,900
skateboard yeah and and and here he had

1741
01:17:25,939 --> 01:17:23,489
already completed what anybody else

1742
01:17:27,800 --> 01:17:25,949
would you know multiple lifetimes and I

1743
01:17:31,790 --> 01:17:27,810
don't understand where he got it from I

1744
01:17:33,979 --> 01:17:31,800
think I think I can go with a paranormal

1745
01:17:35,570 --> 01:17:33,989
or supernatural answer with that because

1746
01:17:36,050 --> 01:17:35,580
it's the only thing that kind of makes

1747
01:17:38,720 --> 01:17:36,060
sense

1748
01:17:40,189 --> 01:17:38,730
yes it's extraordinary and you know I

1749
01:17:42,050 --> 01:17:40,199
write about Manley's life in occult

1750
01:17:43,399 --> 01:17:42,060
America and I I mean I'm learning more

1751
01:17:43,850 --> 01:17:43,409
and more about the dimensions of his

1752
01:17:46,220 --> 01:17:43,860
life

1753
01:17:48,649 --> 01:17:46,230
I have an ant follow I just finished

1754
01:17:50,540 --> 01:17:48,659
assembling and introducing an anthology

1755
01:17:52,100 --> 01:17:50,550
of Manley's historical writings called

1756
01:17:54,620 --> 01:17:52,110
the secret history of America which is

1757
01:17:56,810 --> 01:17:54,630
going to come out next 4th of July from

1758
01:17:59,030 --> 01:17:56,820
st. Martin's Press and that was a real

1759
01:18:00,410 --> 01:17:59,040
joy to work on and I found actually as I

1760
01:18:02,270 --> 01:18:00,420
was working on that and I've been

1761
01:18:03,950 --> 01:18:02,280
writing about this maybe for the past

1762
01:18:05,570 --> 01:18:03,960
eight or nine years there's absolutely

1763
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:05,580
no question that Manley had a

1764
01:18:11,030 --> 01:18:07,770
relationship with Ronald

1765
01:18:13,400 --> 01:18:11,040
Ragan quoted for manly speeches

1766
01:18:15,140 --> 01:18:13,410
uncredited I discovered in some of

1767
01:18:17,960 --> 01:18:15,150
reagan's speeches going back to the

1768
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:17,970
1950s up through the second term of his

1769
01:18:23,210 --> 01:18:20,570
presidency that he was actually using

1770
01:18:26,780 --> 01:18:23,220
phrases and terms that came directly out

1771
01:18:30,770 --> 01:18:26,790
of manliest work and Reagan had made he

1772
01:18:32,750 --> 01:18:30,780
had made sort of indirect references to

1773
01:18:35,690 --> 01:18:32,760
having met the author of some esoteric

1774
01:18:37,970 --> 01:18:35,700
works and I I've done as much

1775
01:18:39,800 --> 01:18:37,980
historiography as I could bring to the

1776
01:18:42,830 --> 01:18:39,810
matter and I think it's beyond question

1777
01:18:44,960 --> 01:18:42,840
that Reagan and manly Hall had met had

1778
01:18:47,030 --> 01:18:44,970
exchanged ideas we're friendly and I

1779
01:18:48,560 --> 01:18:47,040
know without question that Reagan was

1780
01:18:50,300 --> 01:18:48,570
quoting from Manley and some of his

1781
01:18:52,010 --> 01:18:50,310
speeches because the phraseology is

1782
01:18:53,480 --> 01:18:52,020
identical this is something I've written

1783
01:18:56,920 --> 01:18:53,490
about for the Washington Post and other

1784
01:18:59,360 --> 01:18:56,930
places so manly had some interesting

1785
01:19:01,280 --> 01:18:59,370
connections to mainstream political

1786
01:19:03,860 --> 01:19:01,290
culture as well I mean his influence

1787
01:19:05,510 --> 01:19:03,870
really extended now what about let's

1788
01:19:08,570 --> 01:19:05,520
let's take that thought a step further

1789
01:19:10,160 --> 01:19:08,580
know you've written about this but the

1790
01:19:13,660 --> 01:19:10,170
audience is probably going to hear some

1791
01:19:19,100 --> 01:19:13,670
of this for the first time back in the

1792
01:19:22,250 --> 01:19:19,110
70s and 80s there was chatter on the

1793
01:19:25,430 --> 01:19:22,260
street somewhat in mainstream media that

1794
01:19:27,380 --> 01:19:25,440
there was something esoteric going on in

1795
01:19:32,150 --> 01:19:27,390
the White House right that Nancy was

1796
01:19:34,360 --> 01:19:32,160
into this and astrologers and and there

1797
01:19:37,310 --> 01:19:34,370
was something going on where they were

1798
01:19:39,620 --> 01:19:37,320
consulting there was that but back in in

1799
01:19:41,570 --> 01:19:39,630
the 60s and 70s here in Southern

1800
01:19:45,410 --> 01:19:41,580
California it was less populated

1801
01:19:47,570 --> 01:19:45,420
everybody was they knew each other

1802
01:19:50,060 --> 01:19:47,580
certainly in social settings too as well

1803
01:19:52,820 --> 01:19:50,070
and I wouldn't doubt if Ronald and Nancy

1804
01:19:55,970 --> 01:19:52,830
were into this that of course they cross

1805
01:19:58,940 --> 01:19:55,980
paths with Manley and I and his people

1806
01:20:01,150 --> 01:19:58,950
but how far did it go did it make it

1807
01:20:04,010 --> 01:20:01,160
into the governor's mansion here and in

1808
01:20:06,410 --> 01:20:04,020
California and did it did Manley go all

1809
01:20:08,210 --> 01:20:06,420
the way to the Oval Office

1810
01:20:11,170 --> 01:20:08,220
not not physically but certainly

1811
01:20:13,790 --> 01:20:11,180
philosophically philosophically yes and

1812
01:20:16,220 --> 01:20:13,800
you know I've written about this in a

1813
01:20:17,900 --> 01:20:16,230
number of places my book one simple idea

1814
01:20:20,100 --> 01:20:17,910
which is about the positive thinking

1815
01:20:22,440 --> 01:20:20,110
movement Ronald Reagan plays a

1816
01:20:27,240 --> 01:20:22,450
in that book which the Chinese

1817
01:20:28,920 --> 01:20:27,250
government was kind enough to censor in

1818
01:20:30,660 --> 01:20:28,930
that in that book I write about the

1819
01:20:34,080 --> 01:20:30,670
relationship between Manley Hall and

1820
01:20:37,500 --> 01:20:34,090
Ronald Reagan and there's no question

1821
01:20:40,890 --> 01:20:37,510
that man Lee's ideas about America as a

1822
01:20:46,530 --> 01:20:40,900
kind of Holy Grail among nations as a

1823
01:20:48,780 --> 01:20:46,540
kind of vouchsafe keeper of personal

1824
01:20:51,300 --> 01:20:48,790
liberty and the protection of the

1825
01:20:53,160 --> 01:20:51,310
individual search for meaning this idea

1826
01:20:56,550 --> 01:20:53,170
that America had a special role to play

1827
01:20:59,490 --> 01:20:56,560
in the world as kind of a a keeper of

1828
01:21:01,830 --> 01:20:59,500
the flame of the search for meaning as a

1829
01:21:03,720 --> 01:21:01,840
protector of the search for meaning at

1830
01:21:07,290 --> 01:21:03,730
least in its highest moments in its

1831
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:07,300
highest ideals that was part of man

1832
01:21:13,230 --> 01:21:10,210
Lee's outlook on American history Manley

1833
01:21:15,780 --> 01:21:13,240
felt that America was the recipient of

1834
01:21:18,180 --> 01:21:15,790
certain esoteric ideas that had been

1835
01:21:20,160 --> 01:21:18,190
vouchsafed in Freemasonry and the

1836
01:21:21,630 --> 01:21:20,170
Rosicrucians in certain esoteric

1837
01:21:23,400 --> 01:21:21,640
Brotherhood's these things were

1838
01:21:25,740 --> 01:21:23,410
influences on some of the founders

1839
01:21:29,250 --> 01:21:25,750
including Washington and Franklin and

1840
01:21:31,980 --> 01:21:29,260
that in however flauta way these things

1841
01:21:34,350 --> 01:21:31,990
were enacted in the new nation and that

1842
01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:34,360
America was the recipient of certain

1843
01:21:38,310 --> 01:21:36,850
ancient esoteric ideals particularly

1844
01:21:40,830 --> 01:21:38,320
involving the individual search for

1845
01:21:43,380 --> 01:21:40,840
meaning that idea touched Reagan that

1846
01:21:45,480 --> 01:21:43,390
idea can be found in reagan's speeches

1847
01:21:48,510 --> 01:21:45,490
reagan would talk about such things in

1848
01:21:50,340 --> 01:21:48,520
front of audiences ranging from CPAC to

1849
01:21:52,500 --> 01:21:50,350
literally millions of people watching

1850
01:21:55,680 --> 01:21:52,510
television for the statue of liberty

1851
01:21:57,810 --> 01:21:55,690
centenary celebration and he's quoting

1852
01:22:00,030 --> 01:21:57,820
Manley P Hall it is absolutely

1853
01:22:02,010 --> 01:22:00,040
mind-blowing but the textual evidence is

1854
01:22:03,660 --> 01:22:02,020
as plain as day and I've written about

1855
01:22:05,340 --> 01:22:03,670
it for a lot of mainstream places and

1856
01:22:07,260 --> 01:22:05,350
mainstream historians like Rick

1857
01:22:09,900 --> 01:22:07,270
Pearlstein have quoted me on these

1858
01:22:13,890 --> 01:22:09,910
topics there's no question that man

1859
01:22:15,780 --> 01:22:13,900
Lee's philosophy did influence Reagan's

1860
01:22:17,130 --> 01:22:15,790
outlook so you know that's an

1861
01:22:18,900 --> 01:22:17,140
affirmative answer to your question

1862
01:22:19,770 --> 01:22:18,910
about whether certain esoteric outlooks

1863
01:22:23,030 --> 01:22:19,780
have reached the oval office

1864
01:22:26,790 --> 01:22:23,040
figuratively speaking yes and what about

1865
01:22:29,490 --> 01:22:26,800
the the references to you know Joan

1866
01:22:33,210 --> 01:22:29,500
Quigley and other astrologers and and

1867
01:22:35,610 --> 01:22:33,220
Nancy do you think that I mean I think

1868
01:22:37,920 --> 01:22:35,620
it's factually based now we can

1869
01:22:39,960 --> 01:22:37,930
comfortably say that this is part of the

1870
01:22:43,650 --> 01:22:39,970
historical record Oh without question

1871
01:22:47,430 --> 01:22:43,660
well how far did it go with influencing

1872
01:22:50,550 --> 01:22:47,440
this country and and Ronald my guess

1873
01:22:53,100 --> 01:22:50,560
would be that Joan Quigley who was the

1874
01:22:56,100 --> 01:22:53,110
San francisco-based astrologer who was a

1875
01:22:58,260 --> 01:22:56,110
close confidant of Nancy Reagan's for

1876
01:23:00,900 --> 01:22:58,270
the most part what Joan Quigley did was

1877
01:23:02,220 --> 01:23:00,910
she vetted Reagan's appointment book in

1878
01:23:05,400 --> 01:23:02,230
his appointment calendar

1879
01:23:07,140 --> 01:23:05,410
she might have altered a day where a

1880
01:23:08,430 --> 01:23:07,150
particular announcement was made and

1881
01:23:11,070 --> 01:23:08,440
they'd have altered the day we're

1882
01:23:13,590 --> 01:23:11,080
particularly ting was held I don't think

1883
01:23:15,900 --> 01:23:13,600
her influence extended to policy but it

1884
01:23:18,000 --> 01:23:15,910
extended more to timing and I think

1885
01:23:19,380 --> 01:23:18,010
that's really very doable and and and

1886
01:23:21,210 --> 01:23:19,390
there were people in the White House who

1887
01:23:22,710 --> 01:23:21,220
were gravely concerned about this that's

1888
01:23:24,930 --> 01:23:22,720
you know there was stargazer

1889
01:23:26,580 --> 01:23:24,940
who were who was influencing the timing

1890
01:23:28,290 --> 01:23:26,590
of certain trips or meeting with foreign

1891
01:23:30,840 --> 01:23:28,300
meetings with foreign leaders and so

1892
01:23:32,730 --> 01:23:30,850
forth but in terms of timing there was a

1893
01:23:34,980 --> 01:23:32,740
veritable influence yeah you can't meet

1894
01:23:37,470 --> 01:23:34,990
with Brezhnev Mercury's in retrograde

1895
01:23:39,360 --> 01:23:37,480
exactly exactly that kind of thing was

1896
01:23:41,280 --> 01:23:39,370
talked about and the funny thing is you

1897
01:23:42,600 --> 01:23:41,290
know people always speculate Oh what are

1898
01:23:44,040 --> 01:23:42,610
they occult connections to the White

1899
01:23:45,600 --> 01:23:44,050
House well you know the occult

1900
01:23:48,150 --> 01:23:45,610
connections to the White House are a lot

1901
01:23:48,540 --> 01:23:48,160
like those that you'll find in any walk

1902
01:23:50,760 --> 01:23:48,550
of life

1903
01:23:53,730 --> 01:23:50,770
I mean you will find a certain slice of

1904
01:23:57,030 --> 01:23:53,740
our population that's interested in the

1905
01:23:58,800 --> 01:23:57,040
occult and the same fraction of the

1906
01:24:00,870 --> 01:23:58,810
population that passes through the White

1907
01:24:03,540 --> 01:24:00,880
House or the Supreme Court or Congress

1908
01:24:05,370 --> 01:24:03,550
or corporate Suites also as an interest

1909
01:24:07,830 --> 01:24:05,380
in the occult you know it's a fact that

1910
01:24:09,630 --> 01:24:07,840
Richard Nixon for example not usually

1911
01:24:12,180 --> 01:24:09,640
thought of as a man of occult passions

1912
01:24:13,890 --> 01:24:12,190
met with the psychic gene Dixon in the

1913
01:24:17,100 --> 01:24:13,900
Oval Office literally in the Oval Office

1914
01:24:19,500 --> 01:24:17,110
and we know this because gene appears on

1915
01:24:21,060 --> 01:24:19,510
the Watergate tapes Nixon taped

1916
01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:21,070
everybody for a period of time when he

1917
01:24:25,800 --> 01:24:23,530
met with in the Oval Office and Nixon's

1918
01:24:28,590 --> 01:24:25,810
secretary was close friends with gene

1919
01:24:31,710 --> 01:24:28,600
Dixon she persuaded him to have a

1920
01:24:33,720 --> 01:24:31,720
meeting with her in 1972 in the Oval

1921
01:24:36,030 --> 01:24:33,730
Office which he did he didn't seem to

1922
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:36,040
take it very seriously but there he was

1923
01:24:39,960 --> 01:24:38,170
you know having a conversation with a

1924
01:24:41,399 --> 01:24:39,970
psychic in the Oval Office and it's on

1925
01:24:46,530 --> 01:24:41,409
tape yeah and and

1926
01:24:49,229 --> 01:24:46,540
the today most people don't understand

1927
01:24:53,189 --> 01:24:49,239
Jeane Dixon was big-time oh yeah we're

1928
01:24:56,850 --> 01:24:53,199
talking big-time situation she was a

1929
01:24:59,399 --> 01:24:56,860
virtual household name in America at

1930
01:25:02,729 --> 01:24:59,409
that time yeah yeah she became famous

1931
01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:02,739
because she I suppose you could say

1932
01:25:07,500 --> 01:25:04,690
predicted the assassination of John F

1933
01:25:09,270 --> 01:25:07,510
Kennedy and I have an article at the

1934
01:25:13,320 --> 01:25:09,280
website salon where I write about this

1935
01:25:15,959 --> 01:25:13,330
gene in 1956 in an interview with Parade

1936
01:25:17,520 --> 01:25:15,969
magazine physically described someone a

1937
01:25:19,350 --> 01:25:17,530
lot like Kennedy and talked about him

1938
01:25:21,870 --> 01:25:19,360
being assassinated while in office and

1939
01:25:23,879 --> 01:25:21,880
when you read the words in retrospect

1940
01:25:26,070 --> 01:25:23,889
it's pretty uncanny but what people

1941
01:25:27,990 --> 01:25:26,080
forget of course is the chief also made

1942
01:25:30,240 --> 01:25:28,000
hundreds of predictions that were

1943
01:25:32,100 --> 01:25:30,250
completely wrong and once in a while she

1944
01:25:34,260 --> 01:25:32,110
would get a hit and her words about

1945
01:25:35,520 --> 01:25:34,270
Kennedy were uncanny and it made her

1946
01:25:37,260 --> 01:25:35,530
famous it made her famous

1947
01:25:39,060 --> 01:25:37,270
but of course Jean had a lot of

1948
01:25:40,709 --> 01:25:39,070
predictions that didn't come too fast we

1949
01:25:43,649 --> 01:25:40,719
need to take a break right here when I

1950
01:25:47,160 --> 01:25:43,659
was my mom was all in dead Edgar Cayce

1951
01:25:50,250 --> 01:25:47,170
and in the 60s and 70s and we had all

1952
01:25:53,070 --> 01:25:50,260
the books and stuff my mom loved Jeane

1953
01:25:55,200 --> 01:25:53,080
Dixon right I mean so yeah I'm five six

1954
01:25:57,660 --> 01:25:55,210
I'm a couple of years older than you so

1955
01:25:57,899 --> 01:25:57,670
we you know exactly what I'm talking

1956
01:26:01,169 --> 01:25:57,909
about

1957
01:26:02,310 --> 01:26:01,179
or we're and that that was it and when

1958
01:26:06,149 --> 01:26:02,320
all of that broke down

1959
01:26:06,600 --> 01:26:06,159
in in 72 73 my mouse I knew it I know it

1960
01:26:08,760 --> 01:26:06,610
Gina

1961
01:26:11,430 --> 01:26:08,770
I knew it you know and yeah she was a

1962
01:26:13,800 --> 01:26:11,440
really really big deal and named that

1963
01:26:16,709 --> 01:26:13,810
I've never forgotten let's take a break

1964
01:26:18,870 --> 01:26:16,719
right here Mitch when we come back and I

1965
01:26:21,720 --> 01:26:18,880
talk a little tour terror with you and

1966
01:26:23,820 --> 01:26:21,730
maybe do some we g-o-p a pleasure let's

1967
01:26:26,939 --> 01:26:23,830
do all of that next our guest is Mitch

1968
01:26:28,890 --> 01:26:26,949
Harris and this is the thing I knew we

1969
01:26:31,110 --> 01:26:28,900
would be able to do all of those things

1970
01:26:32,520 --> 01:26:31,120
I love to talk about tonight I'm fade to

1971
01:26:34,740 --> 01:26:32,530
black I'm here to be Church our guest

1972
01:26:37,250 --> 01:26:34,750
Mitch Horowitz we'll be right back after

1973
01:26:43,370 --> 01:26:37,260
this short break stay with us

1974
01:26:49,609 --> 01:26:46,580
way out here we listen to Jimmy Church

1975
01:26:52,109 --> 01:26:49,619
you're listening to faint and black

1976
01:26:53,370 --> 01:26:52,119
always on the edge of the hottest

1977
01:26:56,700 --> 01:26:53,380
alternative talk

1978
01:27:15,859 --> 01:26:56,710
Jimmy church with fade to black stay GRA

1979
01:27:19,529 --> 01:27:15,869
radio.com hurricanes earthquakes

1980
01:27:21,989 --> 01:27:19,539
wildfires this year we've experienced

1981
01:27:24,299 --> 01:27:21,999
more than our fair share this is Jimmy

1982
01:27:26,459 --> 01:27:24,309
Church of fade to black and last month I

1983
01:27:28,620 --> 01:27:26,469
decided to make sure my family does not

1984
01:27:31,520 --> 01:27:28,630
have to worry about food that should we

1985
01:27:34,410 --> 01:27:31,530
get caught in a real emergency situation

1986
01:27:36,270 --> 01:27:34,420
introducing Humana a healthy storable

1987
01:27:38,160 --> 01:27:36,280
product that tastes so good that you'll

1988
01:27:40,709 --> 01:27:38,170
want to eat it every day instead of just

1989
01:27:42,779 --> 01:27:40,719
during those times of duress all new

1990
01:27:46,290 --> 01:27:42,789
manna products have a 25 year shelf life

1991
01:27:48,870 --> 01:27:46,300
our msg and GMO free no preservatives

1992
01:27:50,700 --> 01:27:48,880
and are made in America with the new

1993
01:27:52,620 --> 01:27:50,710
manna pack in your home you'll be able

1994
01:27:55,169 --> 01:27:52,630
to sleep at night knowing that you

1995
01:27:58,379 --> 01:27:55,179
protected your family not only have I

1996
01:28:00,779 --> 01:27:58,389
tasted and tested I own it now you can

1997
01:28:02,910 --> 01:28:00,789
too just click on the new mana banner on

1998
01:28:05,370 --> 01:28:02,920
Jimmy Church radio.com and use the promo

1999
01:28:07,470 --> 01:28:05,380
code Jimmy when you order in addition to

2000
01:28:11,129 --> 01:28:07,480
a discount we'll send you an autograph

2001
01:28:14,370 --> 01:28:11,139
fade to black t-shirt seriously gobekli

2002
01:28:17,189 --> 01:28:14,380
tepe do you want to be an official fade

2003
01:28:19,229 --> 01:28:17,199
or not of course you do this is Jimmy

2004
01:28:21,270 --> 01:28:19,239
Church of fade to black just go to our

2005
01:28:26,069 --> 01:28:21,280
membership section at Jimmy Church

2006
01:28:29,399 --> 01:28:26,079
radio.com so you love talk radio then

2007
01:28:32,489 --> 01:28:29,409
you'll love talk stream live.com talk

2008
01:28:34,500 --> 01:28:32,499
stream live is always on 24/7 with the

2009
01:28:36,330 --> 01:28:34,510
best streaming talk shows find your

2010
01:28:38,700 --> 01:28:36,340
favorite talkers and discover some new

2011
01:28:41,430 --> 01:28:38,710
ones it's free readily available online

2012
01:28:43,259 --> 01:28:41,440
or on mobile with any smartphone or

2013
01:28:45,660 --> 01:28:43,269
tablet finding your favorite talk shows

2014
01:28:49,080 --> 01:28:45,670
all in one place has gotten a whole lot

2015
01:28:50,880 --> 01:28:49,090
easier just go to talk stream live doc

2016
01:28:55,320 --> 01:28:50,890
be sure to download the free apps from

2017
01:28:58,920 --> 01:28:55,330
Google Play or the iTunes App Store you

2018
01:29:06,450 --> 01:28:58,930
listen to us and we listen to you and so

2019
01:29:08,250 --> 01:29:06,460
does the CIA jgr a radio calm if you

2020
01:29:10,590 --> 01:29:08,260
have hard water the lime scale not only

2021
01:29:12,420 --> 01:29:10,600
leaves white spots at clogs pipes and

2022
01:29:14,340 --> 01:29:12,430
breaks down appliances costing you

2023
01:29:16,350 --> 01:29:14,350
hundreds of dollars in energy and where

2024
01:29:18,210 --> 01:29:16,360
eliminate limescale and other water

2025
01:29:20,580 --> 01:29:18,220
issues like brown staining and bad odors

2026
01:29:22,530 --> 01:29:20,590
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2027
01:29:24,780 --> 01:29:22,540
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2028
01:29:26,550 --> 01:29:24,790
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2029
01:29:28,220 --> 01:29:26,560
or chemicals you'll love the way your

2030
01:29:30,240 --> 01:29:28,230
water tastes smells and looks

2031
01:29:32,940 --> 01:29:30,250
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2032
01:29:36,720 --> 01:29:32,950
information go to best water 1 2 3 com

2033
01:29:39,420 --> 01:29:36,730
that's best water 1 2 3 com are you

2034
01:29:41,940 --> 01:29:39,430
intrigued by paranormal talk radio you

2035
01:29:44,820 --> 01:29:41,950
love the new paranormal radio app from

2036
01:29:47,130 --> 01:29:44,830
torque stream live you'll find a great

2037
01:29:50,250 --> 01:29:47,140
selection of talk shows covering UFOs

2038
01:29:52,680 --> 01:29:50,260
ghosts strange phenomena and much more

2039
01:29:54,900 --> 01:29:52,690
download the paranormal radio app now

2040
01:29:57,210 --> 01:29:54,910
and start listening to the very best in

2041
01:29:58,740 --> 01:29:57,220
paranormal talk entertainment including

2042
01:30:01,740 --> 01:29:58,750
the network you're listening to right

2043
01:30:06,380 --> 01:30:01,750
now the paranormal radio app free in

2044
01:30:08,730 --> 01:30:06,390
Google Play and the iOS App Store you

2045
01:30:11,010 --> 01:30:08,740
are listening to fade to black

2046
01:30:15,810 --> 01:30:11,020
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

2047
01:30:17,880 --> 01:30:15,820
Network hi I'm Lisa Vance you're

2048
01:30:20,820 --> 01:30:17,890
listening to Jimmy Church this is a

2049
01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:20,830
revolution the revolution will not be

2050
01:30:30,050 --> 01:30:24,690
televised the revolution is on radio

2051
01:30:30,060 --> 01:31:07,670
[Music]

2052
01:31:12,840 --> 01:31:10,080
welcome back fade to black our guest

2053
01:31:14,790 --> 01:31:12,850
tonight Mitch Horowitz now we're

2054
01:31:17,040 --> 01:31:14,800
covering a lot of stuff tonight but I've

2055
01:31:18,380 --> 01:31:17,050
got to do this and I'm doing this for me

2056
01:31:22,280 --> 01:31:18,390
I'm just letting everybody know that

2057
01:31:24,600 --> 01:31:22,290
tomorrow night right here John Greenwald

2058
01:31:27,230 --> 01:31:24,610
Wednesday night are you ready

2059
01:31:30,330 --> 01:31:27,240
wet State this is the amazing week here

2060
01:31:33,660 --> 01:31:30,340
Julia Moss bridge is here on Wednesday

2061
01:31:38,010 --> 01:31:33,670
and then Thursday night Dean Radin Mitch

2062
01:31:41,850 --> 01:31:38,020
don't you want to be me right now I'm

2063
01:31:43,710 --> 01:31:41,860
still in your identity so cool you know

2064
01:31:45,450 --> 01:31:43,720
sometimes I do have to sit back and go

2065
01:31:49,590 --> 01:31:45,460
pinch me but you know what it's all

2066
01:31:53,540 --> 01:31:49,600
creating your own reality yes now I want

2067
01:31:57,180 --> 01:31:53,550
to talk Tarot and why I love our

2068
01:31:59,460 --> 01:31:57,190
community sometimes things are precious

2069
01:32:02,790 --> 01:31:59,470
to us and I don't like things to change

2070
01:32:06,300 --> 01:32:02,800
and and then commercialism gets involved

2071
01:32:10,050 --> 01:32:06,310
and now with Tarot today I can go out

2072
01:32:18,480 --> 01:32:10,060
and probably buy speed racer tarot cards

2073
01:32:19,110 --> 01:32:18,490
oh sure Pokemon yeah I've seen gummy

2074
01:32:22,530 --> 01:32:19,120
bear

2075
01:32:24,900 --> 01:32:22,540
all right tarot cards so is that is that

2076
01:32:28,590 --> 01:32:24,910
a good thing getting out there to the

2077
01:32:30,690 --> 01:32:28,600
masses you know Barbie tarot cards or is

2078
01:32:33,270 --> 01:32:30,700
this is this something that is

2079
01:32:35,330 --> 01:32:33,280
infringing on something that is still a

2080
01:32:36,660 --> 01:32:35,340
little bit sacred and precious to us

2081
01:32:39,360 --> 01:32:36,670
right

2082
01:32:40,800 --> 01:32:39,370
well it's inevitable of course you know

2083
01:32:43,080 --> 01:32:40,810
I mean everybody's heard of the Ouija

2084
01:32:45,060 --> 01:32:43,090
board and at one time you know in the

2085
01:32:47,610 --> 01:32:45,070
1880s the Ouija board was a homemade

2086
01:32:49,770 --> 01:32:47,620
device that spiritualists are people who

2087
01:32:51,960 --> 01:32:49,780
like talking to the dead we're using in

2088
01:32:54,450 --> 01:32:51,970
their kitchen or in their parlor and

2089
01:32:56,370 --> 01:32:54,460
then some novelty manufacturers in

2090
01:32:59,910 --> 01:32:56,380
Baltimore got hold of it patented the

2091
01:33:02,310 --> 01:32:59,920
thing in 1891 and so was born the Ouija

2092
01:33:04,920 --> 01:33:02,320
board so it's always gonna happen in one

2093
01:33:06,390 --> 01:33:04,930
way or another it's it's it's almost

2094
01:33:09,990 --> 01:33:06,400
like spitting in the wind you know it's

2095
01:33:12,840 --> 01:33:10,000
it's just it it just can't it can't be

2096
01:33:15,740 --> 01:33:12,850
avoided it's a cycle but I have noticed

2097
01:33:18,810 --> 01:33:15,750
that it's very interesting the so-called

2098
01:33:20,400 --> 01:33:18,820
rider-waite deck which was actually

2099
01:33:20,850 --> 01:33:20,410
designed by a brilliant artist named

2100
01:33:23,250 --> 01:33:20,860
Pamela

2101
01:33:25,710 --> 01:33:23,260
Coleman Smith people sometimes now call

2102
01:33:29,580 --> 01:33:25,720
it the Smith wait deck which I think is

2103
01:33:31,710 --> 01:33:29,590
more appropriate that's really the basis

2104
01:33:33,510 --> 01:33:31,720
for all these different tarot decks that

2105
01:33:36,720 --> 01:33:33,520
are out there today you know you really

2106
01:33:39,510 --> 01:33:36,730
have the tower of Marseille and-and-and

2107
01:33:41,310 --> 01:33:39,520
the Smith wait deck and they are kind of

2108
01:33:43,740 --> 01:33:41,320
the decks that everybody uses as their

2109
01:33:45,810 --> 01:33:43,750
go-to decks as their copycat techs and

2110
01:33:48,090 --> 01:33:45,820
so I'm struck that no matter how many

2111
01:33:50,490 --> 01:33:48,100
decks proliferate out there with very

2112
01:33:53,220 --> 01:33:50,500
very few exceptions they're all sort of

2113
01:33:55,350 --> 01:33:53,230
riffing off of Tower of Marseille or the

2114
01:33:57,630 --> 01:33:55,360
wait Smith decade now Crowley's deck the

2115
01:33:59,340 --> 01:33:57,640
Aleister Crowley deck was a hugely

2116
01:34:01,590 --> 01:33:59,350
original deck that one's not so easily

2117
01:34:04,170 --> 01:34:01,600
copycatted but many of these decks out

2118
01:34:05,160 --> 01:34:04,180
there just you know reworkings of of

2119
01:34:07,470 --> 01:34:05,170
what

2120
01:34:10,260 --> 01:34:07,480
Pamela Coleman Smith did 125 years ago

2121
01:34:12,270 --> 01:34:10,270
have you seen the hexans earn deck I

2122
01:34:15,300 --> 01:34:12,280
have not seen that have you heard about

2123
01:34:18,720 --> 01:34:15,310
it no no first I'm hearing of it okay

2124
01:34:20,730 --> 01:34:18,730
Suzanne tri stern designed it okay okay

2125
01:34:22,880 --> 01:34:20,740
all right well you know CERN and

2126
01:34:27,750 --> 01:34:22,890
everything that is going on with that

2127
01:34:29,490 --> 01:34:27,760
and quite possibly with the supernatural

2128
01:34:31,460 --> 01:34:29,500
in the paranormal which I don't doubt

2129
01:34:35,190 --> 01:34:31,470
that there's things going on there but

2130
01:34:38,160 --> 01:34:35,200
yeah there was a hexan cern deck created

2131
01:34:42,840 --> 01:34:38,170
so you need to go and check that out now

2132
01:34:44,580 --> 01:34:42,850
does it does a Barbie tarot deck change

2133
01:34:47,220 --> 01:34:44,590
the way you would do somebody's reading

2134
01:34:48,870 --> 01:34:47,230
I'm being a little bit Cavalier here but

2135
01:34:50,700 --> 01:34:48,880
yeah thank you I would say it does in

2136
01:34:53,040 --> 01:34:50,710
the sense that look you know one of the

2137
01:34:55,710 --> 01:34:53,050
things I love about Tarot is that it's a

2138
01:34:57,420 --> 01:34:55,720
vessel for certain hermetic ideas you

2139
01:34:59,490 --> 01:34:57,430
know hermeticism was this kind of Greek

2140
01:35:00,180 --> 01:34:59,500
Egyptian philosophy that existed in Late

2141
01:35:02,760 --> 01:35:00,190
Antiquity

2142
01:35:05,940 --> 01:35:02,770
was a big influence on Europe in the

2143
01:35:09,240 --> 01:35:05,950
Renaissance age when when the Tarot that

2144
01:35:11,610 --> 01:35:09,250
we recognized got developed and I think

2145
01:35:13,050 --> 01:35:11,620
that Tarot especially the decks I've

2146
01:35:15,780 --> 01:35:13,060
just mentioned I've mentioned earlier

2147
01:35:18,750 --> 01:35:15,790
taraf Marseille the weights myth taro

2148
01:35:21,480 --> 01:35:18,760
and Crowley's Tarot among others are

2149
01:35:22,980 --> 01:35:21,490
vessels of hermetic imagery and ideas if

2150
01:35:24,660 --> 01:35:22,990
you water that down to the point where

2151
01:35:26,790 --> 01:35:24,670
using Barbie and gummy bears

2152
01:35:28,800 --> 01:35:26,800
I think the mystical allegory sort

2153
01:35:30,270 --> 01:35:28,810
starts to disappear you know at that

2154
01:35:33,110 --> 01:35:30,280
point you're kind of playing magic

2155
01:35:34,510 --> 01:35:33,120
8-ball and something that really uses

2156
01:35:41,290 --> 01:35:34,520
allegorical image

2157
01:35:42,700 --> 01:35:41,300
and what what part of the mind when

2158
01:35:45,370 --> 01:35:42,710
we're talking about Tarot

2159
01:35:48,850 --> 01:35:45,380
and especially your and we understand

2160
01:35:50,400 --> 01:35:48,860
magic today or we're getting closer to

2161
01:35:53,560 --> 01:35:50,410
it I should say how much of that

2162
01:35:55,660 --> 01:35:53,570
influences what happens with the Tarot

2163
01:35:57,160 --> 01:35:55,670
when you're doing a reading that's a

2164
01:35:59,380 --> 01:35:57,170
really good question you know I've been

2165
01:36:02,590 --> 01:35:59,390
doing a huge number of readings recently

2166
01:36:06,040 --> 01:36:02,600
because III recently collaborated on

2167
01:36:09,310 --> 01:36:06,050
this little historical video this little

2168
01:36:11,650 --> 01:36:09,320
mini documentary with Gaia called the

2169
01:36:13,330 --> 01:36:11,660
hidden history of Tarot and that's up on

2170
01:36:15,580 --> 01:36:13,340
YouTube now and I was so pleased with

2171
01:36:19,000 --> 01:36:15,590
how it came out that to celebrate on

2172
01:36:22,380 --> 01:36:19,010
social media I offered people free

2173
01:36:24,580 --> 01:36:22,390
three-card tarot readings and so I got

2174
01:36:26,740 --> 01:36:24,590
hundreds of people who took me up on

2175
01:36:28,930 --> 01:36:26,750
this and I spent fourth of July weekend

2176
01:36:30,940 --> 01:36:28,940
sort of intensively doing these three

2177
01:36:32,650 --> 01:36:30,950
card readings for people and it was very

2178
01:36:34,690 --> 01:36:32,660
gratifying and very interesting but it

2179
01:36:36,760 --> 01:36:34,700
gave me insight into the into the

2180
01:36:40,030 --> 01:36:36,770
process and one of the things I found is

2181
01:36:41,620 --> 01:36:40,040
that Tarot can I mean it has many

2182
01:36:44,620 --> 01:36:41,630
different dimensions to it but it could

2183
01:36:45,790 --> 01:36:44,630
also be a psychological snapshot of what

2184
01:36:47,170 --> 01:36:45,800
you're thinking what you're going

2185
01:36:49,810 --> 01:36:47,180
through what you're into inning at that

2186
01:36:51,550 --> 01:36:49,820
moment which is why it can change so

2187
01:36:53,170 --> 01:36:51,560
quickly but I think there's something

2188
01:36:54,820 --> 01:36:53,180
deeper than that going on because I was

2189
01:36:59,230 --> 01:36:54,830
doing readings for people who were at a

2190
01:37:00,820 --> 01:36:59,240
a great physical geographical removed

2191
01:37:03,160 --> 01:37:00,830
from me and sometimes there were points

2192
01:37:05,620 --> 01:37:03,170
in the readings that hit upon real

2193
01:37:07,780 --> 01:37:05,630
intimate details of their lives and it

2194
01:37:11,170 --> 01:37:07,790
was it was quite remarkable in certain

2195
01:37:13,720 --> 01:37:11,180
cases explain it three cards spread for

2196
01:37:15,460 --> 01:37:13,730
everybody we have once a year we do a

2197
01:37:19,240 --> 01:37:15,470
tarot reading here on the show on

2198
01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:19,250
Halloween with one of one of our

2199
01:37:25,150 --> 01:37:20,810
favorite guests have been with us for

2200
01:37:27,550 --> 01:37:25,160
years but listening to the happened you

2201
01:37:29,350 --> 01:37:27,560
know very quick yeah I don't think the

2202
01:37:31,060 --> 01:37:29,360
audience necessarily understands what's

2203
01:37:33,490 --> 01:37:31,070
going on what's a three card spread a

2204
01:37:36,550 --> 01:37:33,500
three card spread is a very simple

2205
01:37:38,470 --> 01:37:36,560
spread that that was actually come up

2206
01:37:40,900 --> 01:37:38,480
with by my friend Robert place who's a

2207
01:37:43,120 --> 01:37:40,910
great artist and historian of Tarot and

2208
01:37:45,340 --> 01:37:43,130
what you do is you basically you shuffle

2209
01:37:47,980 --> 01:37:45,350
the deck thoroughly you lay it out you

2210
01:37:50,110 --> 01:37:47,990
into it which cards you want to pick

2211
01:37:52,270 --> 01:37:50,120
turn them over you ignore reverse cards

2212
01:37:54,670 --> 01:37:52,280
you don't get involved with reverse cars

2213
01:37:55,870 --> 01:37:54,680
which is actually part of my practice I

2214
01:37:59,110 --> 01:37:55,880
think we get too obsessed with the

2215
01:38:00,880 --> 01:37:59,120
meaning of reverse cards and you turn

2216
01:38:02,890 --> 01:38:00,890
over the three cards and you look at

2217
01:38:04,240 --> 01:38:02,900
them and you try to find a storyline

2218
01:38:06,130 --> 01:38:04,250
within them almost as if you were

2219
01:38:08,290 --> 01:38:06,140
looking at a comic strip now sometimes

2220
01:38:10,690 --> 01:38:08,300
you will find a left-to-right flow a

2221
01:38:12,280 --> 01:38:10,700
right-to-left flow other times you'll

2222
01:38:14,500 --> 01:38:12,290
find the two cards on either end

2223
01:38:17,470 --> 01:38:14,510
impacting on the center card but the

2224
01:38:19,330 --> 01:38:17,480
accuracy if these simple readings can

2225
01:38:22,060 --> 01:38:19,340
really be extraordinary they can almost

2226
01:38:23,500 --> 01:38:22,070
be like this this this core sample of

2227
01:38:25,780 --> 01:38:23,510
what somebody's going through it at the

2228
01:38:27,460 --> 01:38:25,790
moment and I tend to really gravitate

2229
01:38:29,380 --> 01:38:27,470
towards things that are simple and that

2230
01:38:31,390 --> 01:38:29,390
are essential and that are basic and for

2231
01:38:34,240 --> 01:38:31,400
that reason I like the three-card spread

2232
01:38:35,830 --> 01:38:34,250
do you have a favorite spread my

2233
01:38:37,630 --> 01:38:35,840
favorite is really the three-card you

2234
01:38:39,910 --> 01:38:37,640
know I've been practicing it for years

2235
01:38:42,010 --> 01:38:39,920
once after place taught it to me and

2236
01:38:43,710 --> 01:38:42,020
I've never moved away from it I always

2237
01:38:47,470 --> 01:38:43,720
found that there's so much psychological

2238
01:38:49,330 --> 01:38:47,480
texture within the weight Smith deck for

2239
01:38:51,460 --> 01:38:49,340
example none of this I think can be

2240
01:38:54,610 --> 01:38:51,470
captured by the gummy bear deck that

2241
01:38:56,860 --> 01:38:54,620
when you lay out these cards in in in a

2242
01:38:59,260 --> 01:38:56,870
spread of three you could find out a

2243
01:39:03,160 --> 01:38:59,270
whole epic story within it now what

2244
01:39:05,560 --> 01:39:03,170
about you okay so what if you do 250

2245
01:39:08,380 --> 01:39:05,570
right well you just said right did you

2246
01:39:11,320 --> 01:39:08,390
see anything repetitive did you see a

2247
01:39:15,460 --> 01:39:11,330
pattern between all of those readings

2248
01:39:17,200 --> 01:39:15,470
well the pattern that I saw were really

2249
01:39:18,940 --> 01:39:17,210
in the nature of the questions the three

2250
01:39:22,210 --> 01:39:18,950
most popular questions that came up

2251
01:39:23,800 --> 01:39:22,220
again and again were career romance and

2252
01:39:25,090 --> 01:39:23,810
inner development once in a while

2253
01:39:26,590 --> 01:39:25,100
somebody would ask something about

2254
01:39:29,260 --> 01:39:26,600
health once in a while somebody would

2255
01:39:31,450 --> 01:39:29,270
ask something about geography but it was

2256
01:39:35,290 --> 01:39:31,460
and in that order in that order career

2257
01:39:36,910 --> 01:39:35,300
or money romance and inner development

2258
01:39:38,530 --> 01:39:36,920
and there were some people who were

2259
01:39:40,900 --> 01:39:38,540
embarrassed who said to me gee I hate to

2260
01:39:42,700 --> 01:39:40,910
ask such a standard question about my

2261
01:39:44,860 --> 01:39:42,710
job or about money or about my love life

2262
01:39:46,630 --> 01:39:44,870
but I thought to myself nobody should

2263
01:39:48,640 --> 01:39:46,640
ever be embarrassed by these questions

2264
01:39:51,970 --> 01:39:48,650
this is the stuff of life this is what

2265
01:39:54,340 --> 01:39:51,980
we do I mean we're here to be generative

2266
01:39:57,160 --> 01:39:54,350
we're here to be productive we're here

2267
01:39:59,790 --> 01:39:57,170
in relationships I mean you know things

2268
01:40:01,750 --> 01:39:59,800
about career and money often cut to the

2269
01:40:04,210 --> 01:40:01,760
essence of what a

2270
01:40:06,070 --> 01:40:04,220
person feels he or she is doing with

2271
01:40:08,710 --> 01:40:06,080
life and of course relationships are all

2272
01:40:10,090 --> 01:40:08,720
important and and people have questions

2273
01:40:12,130 --> 01:40:10,100
about their inner development but I

2274
01:40:14,920 --> 01:40:12,140
never wanted anybody to feel shy or

2275
01:40:16,600 --> 01:40:14,930
embarrassed by asking a material

2276
01:40:18,580 --> 01:40:16,610
question matters of money matters of

2277
01:40:21,220 --> 01:40:18,590
sexuality matters of relationships

2278
01:40:23,200 --> 01:40:21,230
matters of where do I live these things

2279
01:40:26,740 --> 01:40:23,210
to me are sacred questions I don't think

2280
01:40:28,420 --> 01:40:26,750
people have to a sorta dandy up or clean

2281
01:40:30,520 --> 01:40:28,430
up their questions not with me at least

2282
01:40:32,170 --> 01:40:30,530
I feel these things are they cut to the

2283
01:40:34,000 --> 01:40:32,180
essence of what we're doing with our

2284
01:40:35,620 --> 01:40:34,010
lives yeah absolutely when somebody

2285
01:40:39,010 --> 01:40:35,630
asked about their job well quite

2286
01:40:41,080 --> 01:40:39,020
honestly that's they are concerned about

2287
01:40:43,090 --> 01:40:41,090
their job right there yeah I'm asking

2288
01:40:45,040 --> 01:40:43,100
about anything else do you do readings

2289
01:40:47,440 --> 01:40:45,050
with friends with people that you are

2290
01:40:50,380 --> 01:40:47,450
intimately oh you have relationships

2291
01:40:52,540 --> 01:40:50,390
with I do all the time does it get you

2292
01:40:54,340 --> 01:40:52,550
in trouble I don't think I've ever

2293
01:40:56,230 --> 01:40:54,350
gotten in trouble but I'll always be

2294
01:40:58,630 --> 01:40:56,240
blunt with people you know I mean I'm

2295
01:41:00,040 --> 01:40:58,640
never gonna hide the death card from

2296
01:41:03,310 --> 01:41:00,050
number something else that you know

2297
01:41:04,780 --> 01:41:03,320
might cause alarm I I feel like whether

2298
01:41:06,370 --> 01:41:04,790
I'm doing it for an intimate friend

2299
01:41:07,960 --> 01:41:06,380
whether I'm doing it for myself

2300
01:41:10,390 --> 01:41:07,970
whether I'm doing it for somebody who's

2301
01:41:12,910 --> 01:41:10,400
at the remove of social media I never

2302
01:41:15,310 --> 01:41:12,920
want to mislead people you know I I will

2303
01:41:18,550 --> 01:41:15,320
I will lay out the deck and and I'll

2304
01:41:20,950 --> 01:41:18,560
describe to them exactly what I see I'll

2305
01:41:22,630 --> 01:41:20,960
never you know try to hide things or or

2306
01:41:25,510 --> 01:41:22,640
spin them in a certain direction I think

2307
01:41:29,650 --> 01:41:25,520
the New Age culture has gotten too hung

2308
01:41:31,450 --> 01:41:29,660
up on trying to spin everything as you

2309
01:41:33,370 --> 01:41:31,460
know it's Rosie opposite if you get the

2310
01:41:35,680 --> 01:41:33,380
death card if you get the tower if you

2311
01:41:37,120 --> 01:41:35,690
get something that seems foreboding well

2312
01:41:39,280 --> 01:41:37,130
you know sometimes life has these

2313
01:41:40,990 --> 01:41:39,290
episodes for us and sometimes these are

2314
01:41:42,730 --> 01:41:41,000
the episodes that prove to be spring

2315
01:41:44,590 --> 01:41:42,740
boards that actually deliver us to

2316
01:41:46,420 --> 01:41:44,600
something that we desperately need so I

2317
01:41:49,320 --> 01:41:46,430
always try to be very blunt with people

2318
01:41:53,140 --> 01:41:49,330
about what I find was was terror always

2319
01:41:55,300 --> 01:41:53,150
used the way it is today no tarot really

2320
01:41:58,150 --> 01:41:55,310
began in the Middle Ages as a game a

2321
01:42:00,070 --> 01:41:58,160
gimmick was it a gimmick or a game again

2322
01:42:01,720 --> 01:42:00,080
it was a precursor to bridge but what a

2323
01:42:05,020 --> 01:42:01,730
lot of people don't understand when they

2324
01:42:08,290 --> 01:42:05,030
hear that is that in the Middle Ages a

2325
01:42:10,510 --> 01:42:08,300
game was something that had much more

2326
01:42:11,860 --> 01:42:10,520
gravity than it does today today we

2327
01:42:14,890 --> 01:42:11,870
think of a game as something frivolous

2328
01:42:15,710 --> 01:42:14,900
but in the Middle Ages a game could be

2329
01:42:19,460 --> 01:42:15,720
something

2330
01:42:20,900 --> 01:42:19,470
had grave and very serious meaning

2331
01:42:23,090 --> 01:42:20,910
attached to it like just look at the

2332
01:42:25,280 --> 01:42:23,100
images that you find on the oldest cards

2333
01:42:28,790 --> 01:42:25,290
these are images that were part of the

2334
01:42:32,030 --> 01:42:28,800
religious life of the Western world the

2335
01:42:32,900 --> 01:42:32,040
Grim Reaper the Pope the juggler or the

2336
01:42:35,390 --> 01:42:32,910
magician

2337
01:42:37,030 --> 01:42:35,400
the Empress angels these were the

2338
01:42:40,040 --> 01:42:37,040
figures that you saw on stained-glass

2339
01:42:42,200 --> 01:42:40,050
windows if you want to understand Tarot

2340
01:42:44,840 --> 01:42:42,210
understand stained-glass windows these

2341
01:42:48,470 --> 01:42:44,850
were sacred works of art that came out

2342
01:42:51,080 --> 01:42:48,480
of Middle Ages passion plays these were

2343
01:42:53,570 --> 01:42:51,090
influenced by mystical Christianity by

2344
01:42:56,210 --> 01:42:53,580
hermetic thoughts so when I say taro

2345
01:42:58,460 --> 01:42:56,220
began as a game some people take umbrage

2346
01:43:02,390 --> 01:42:58,470
of that but we don't always understand

2347
01:43:06,620 --> 01:43:02,400
that everything in Middle Ages and early

2348
01:43:09,250 --> 01:43:06,630
Renaissance life was a matter of great

2349
01:43:12,200 --> 01:43:09,260
seriousness anything that went beyond

2350
01:43:14,630 --> 01:43:12,210
labor was a matter of great seriousness

2351
01:43:16,490 --> 01:43:14,640
and was a beaut with religious

2352
01:43:18,380 --> 01:43:16,500
philosophy with religious meaning with

2353
01:43:22,010 --> 01:43:18,390
humanity's sense of itself is belonging

2354
01:43:23,930 --> 01:43:22,020
to some sort of scale that led from our

2355
01:43:26,030 --> 01:43:23,940
course material life up to the heavens

2356
01:43:28,550 --> 01:43:26,040
and these were the images that were used

2357
01:43:32,150 --> 01:43:28,560
on the tarot deck so it was it was a

2358
01:43:35,240 --> 01:43:32,160
game but in that that that term had much

2359
01:43:37,910 --> 01:43:35,250
greater meaning and gravity well what

2360
01:43:40,580 --> 01:43:37,920
period was it what period are we talking

2361
01:43:44,060 --> 01:43:40,590
about what year we're talking about the

2362
01:43:46,340 --> 01:43:44,070
the late 1300s early 14th hundreds those

2363
01:43:48,370 --> 01:43:46,350
are the oldest examples that we have of

2364
01:43:50,840 --> 01:43:48,380
tarot cards that would be in any way

2365
01:43:52,340 --> 01:43:50,850
recognizable to us today interesting

2366
01:43:55,820 --> 01:43:52,350
okay so now we're talking about the

2367
01:43:58,250 --> 01:43:55,830
serious Renaissance right yeah and when

2368
01:44:00,830 --> 01:43:58,260
did the how long did that last and when

2369
01:44:03,320 --> 01:44:00,840
did the change who was responsible for

2370
01:44:04,970 --> 01:44:03,330
the changes that ended up happening well

2371
01:44:07,370 --> 01:44:04,980
it's interesting you know in in the

2372
01:44:10,280 --> 01:44:07,380
first decks emerged in Florence Italy

2373
01:44:12,680 --> 01:44:10,290
but later the region of Marseille and

2374
01:44:14,810 --> 01:44:12,690
France became known as a center of tower

2375
01:44:17,750 --> 01:44:14,820
production which is why the Marseille

2376
01:44:20,120 --> 01:44:17,760
deck is probably one of the oldest fully

2377
01:44:24,170 --> 01:44:20,130
intact decks that we have but it wasn't

2378
01:44:28,730 --> 01:44:24,180
until the mmm wasn't until basically

2379
01:44:29,729 --> 01:44:28,740
like the 1790s that Tarot began to get

2380
01:44:32,430 --> 01:44:29,739
used as

2381
01:44:34,830 --> 01:44:32,440
a fortune-telling device and it wasn't

2382
01:44:37,080 --> 01:44:34,840
until about a hundred years later that

2383
01:44:39,360 --> 01:44:37,090
Pamela Coleman Smith designed the deck

2384
01:44:41,370 --> 01:44:39,370
that's so familiar to us today where the

2385
01:44:45,060 --> 01:44:41,380
minor Trump's for example and the court

2386
01:44:47,370 --> 01:44:45,070
cards were imbued with these magnificent

2387
01:44:50,100 --> 01:44:47,380
mysterious illustrations so Tarot is

2388
01:44:51,810 --> 01:44:50,110
really a modern device but nobody should

2389
01:44:54,030 --> 01:44:51,820
feel that because something is modern

2390
01:44:56,400 --> 01:44:54,040
that means it doesn't have potency

2391
01:44:58,229 --> 01:44:56,410
traditions have to start somewhere the

2392
01:45:01,950 --> 01:44:58,239
Tower of Marseilles deck is a lot more

2393
01:45:06,030 --> 01:45:01,960
sparsely illustrated from the 1400s than

2394
01:45:09,780 --> 01:45:06,040
the the Coleman than the Smith wait deck

2395
01:45:12,690 --> 01:45:09,790
which was developed in the 1890s the two

2396
01:45:15,959 --> 01:45:12,700
are are leaps apart but the fact that

2397
01:45:18,390 --> 01:45:15,969
Tarot is in many regards a modern

2398
01:45:20,130 --> 01:45:18,400
development doesn't mean that there's

2399
01:45:21,750 --> 01:45:20,140
not gravity to it that there's not

2400
01:45:22,950 --> 01:45:21,760
serious to it the seriousness to it

2401
01:45:25,020 --> 01:45:22,960
something doesn't have to have an

2402
01:45:28,160 --> 01:45:25,030
ancient antecedent in order to have

2403
01:45:30,979 --> 01:45:28,170
meaning so when did it go from

2404
01:45:36,720 --> 01:45:30,989
fortune-telling which I would almost

2405
01:45:38,340 --> 01:45:36,730
lean on maybe chemic right to today

2406
01:45:39,600 --> 01:45:38,350
where it is you know it's a very serious

2407
01:45:42,810 --> 01:45:39,610
practice today

2408
01:45:44,910 --> 01:45:42,820
well that transition happen well in the

2409
01:45:46,920 --> 01:45:44,920
1790s you know people began to use it

2410
01:45:50,100 --> 01:45:46,930
for divinatory purposes and that was

2411
01:45:52,979 --> 01:45:50,110
really the first time that you began to

2412
01:45:56,160 --> 01:45:52,989
encounter Tarot as a popular tool of

2413
01:45:58,350 --> 01:45:56,170
divination and fortune-telling and then

2414
01:46:00,450 --> 01:45:58,360
it was probably with the occult revival

2415
01:46:02,430 --> 01:46:00,460
beginning in the mid to late nineteenth

2416
01:46:05,940 --> 01:46:02,440
century that people began to look upon

2417
01:46:08,820 --> 01:46:05,950
Tarot as a vessel as a time capsule of

2418
01:46:10,920 --> 01:46:08,830
hermetic or ancient Egyptian ideas and

2419
01:46:13,500 --> 01:46:10,930
again you know that's really a modern

2420
01:46:16,140 --> 01:46:13,510
perception I do think it is a vessel for

2421
01:46:18,450 --> 01:46:16,150
hermetic ideas but it doesn't have these

2422
01:46:19,860 --> 01:46:18,460
specific roots in ancient Egypt doesn't

2423
01:46:22,770 --> 01:46:19,870
have a family tree that goes back to

2424
01:46:25,620 --> 01:46:22,780
ancient Egypt that's basically invention

2425
01:46:27,450 --> 01:46:25,630
but the fact is it is a vessel for

2426
01:46:29,910 --> 01:46:27,460
certain hermetic ideas and as people

2427
01:46:31,920 --> 01:46:29,920
began to grok to that and began to grok

2428
01:46:34,410 --> 01:46:31,930
to the mystical allegory that appeared

2429
01:46:37,140 --> 01:46:34,420
some of these cards again images of the

2430
01:46:39,420 --> 01:46:37,150
angel the Pope death the magician these

2431
01:46:42,540 --> 01:46:39,430
are images that are very deep spiritual

2432
01:46:43,590 --> 01:46:42,550
archetypes in the Western mind mid 19th

2433
01:46:45,660 --> 01:46:43,600
to late 19th

2434
01:46:48,470 --> 01:46:45,670
entry people began to get more serious

2435
01:46:52,260 --> 01:46:48,480
about the interpretations of Tarot and

2436
01:46:53,880 --> 01:46:52,270
that's really the the the the point of

2437
01:46:55,680 --> 01:46:53,890
view that's informed our perspective

2438
01:46:57,570 --> 01:46:55,690
today you know we those of us who are

2439
01:46:59,430 --> 01:46:57,580
into Tarot as I am take it very

2440
01:47:01,200 --> 01:46:59,440
seriously today but taking it seriously

2441
01:47:03,270 --> 01:47:01,210
doesn't mean that you have to turn a

2442
01:47:06,630 --> 01:47:03,280
blind eye to its history it has a modern

2443
01:47:10,110 --> 01:47:06,640
history but that modern history has also

2444
01:47:12,090 --> 01:47:10,120
served as a vessel for hermetic ideas

2445
01:47:14,580 --> 01:47:12,100
and ideas that really cut to the

2446
01:47:17,580 --> 01:47:14,590
archetypes of Western spiritual images

2447
01:47:20,520 --> 01:47:17,590
no did did Joan Quigley

2448
01:47:22,800 --> 01:47:20,530
Tarot not that I know of she was pretty

2449
01:47:24,810 --> 01:47:22,810
exclusively an astrologer and she was

2450
01:47:26,970 --> 01:47:24,820
also a high society astrologer Joan

2451
01:47:30,420 --> 01:47:26,980
Quigley was Nancy Reagan's astrologer

2452
01:47:32,490 --> 01:47:30,430
was came from a wealthy family a very

2453
01:47:34,080 --> 01:47:32,500
high tone background in San Francisco

2454
01:47:36,740 --> 01:47:34,090
and that she was politically

2455
01:47:38,970 --> 01:47:36,750
conservative and she tended to do

2456
01:47:40,920 --> 01:47:38,980
astrological readings for people who

2457
01:47:43,110 --> 01:47:40,930
came from the upper crust of society

2458
01:47:44,880 --> 01:47:43,120
like ANSI Regan I was just wondering if

2459
01:47:48,120 --> 01:47:44,890
there was any tarot readings going down

2460
01:47:50,520 --> 01:47:48,130
on 1600 Pennsylvania well I will tell

2461
01:47:53,250 --> 01:47:50,530
you this and I write about this in one

2462
01:47:55,980 --> 01:47:53,260
simple idea Ronald Reagan was pals

2463
01:47:57,960 --> 01:47:55,990
during his moviemaking days with a woman

2464
01:48:00,900 --> 01:47:57,970
named Eden gray who wrote some of the

2465
01:48:02,130 --> 01:48:00,910
first popular guides to Tarot some of

2466
01:48:04,290 --> 01:48:02,140
your listeners probably know the name

2467
01:48:07,410 --> 01:48:04,300
Eden gray she's she she produced some

2468
01:48:10,320 --> 01:48:07,420
popular Tarot guides in the early 1960s

2469
01:48:11,820 --> 01:48:10,330
up through the 1970s and she and Reagan

2470
01:48:14,490 --> 01:48:11,830
were in one movie together and they were

2471
01:48:18,450 --> 01:48:14,500
friendly now when we talk about meth it

2472
01:48:24,090 --> 01:48:18,460
just freaks me out oh oh oh oh I meant

2473
01:48:27,120 --> 01:48:24,100
to ask you the cover of I think it was

2474
01:48:29,490 --> 01:48:27,130
the Economist uh do you remember the

2475
01:48:32,760 --> 01:48:29,500
tarot cards that were created for that

2476
01:48:34,620 --> 01:48:32,770
cover when Trump was elected I do not

2477
01:48:36,300 --> 01:48:34,630
but I'd like to see that okay have to

2478
01:48:38,820 --> 01:48:36,310
post that on Twitter hey just one it

2479
01:48:41,940 --> 01:48:38,830
just popped up on Twitter right now cool

2480
01:48:44,930 --> 01:48:41,950
let me get this over to you so you can

2481
01:48:48,600 --> 01:48:44,940
actually see this there was a lot of

2482
01:48:52,640 --> 01:48:48,610
controversy behind this let me I mean

2483
01:48:57,070 --> 01:48:52,650
make sure your your hit here hold on to

2484
01:49:00,070 --> 01:48:57,080
dirt or dirt or two there you are son

2485
01:49:03,190 --> 01:49:00,080
my hands are trembling yeah this is this

2486
01:49:05,110 --> 01:49:03,200
is pretty nutty stuff here and when this

2487
01:49:08,920 --> 01:49:05,120
hit okay you've got it you've got it

2488
01:49:14,740 --> 01:49:08,930
Mitch when these cards hit there was so

2489
01:49:16,630 --> 01:49:14,750
much put behind this so take a quick

2490
01:49:18,520 --> 01:49:16,640
peek at that all right I'm going to your

2491
01:49:22,750 --> 01:49:18,530
page right now hang on one second

2492
01:49:24,520 --> 01:49:22,760
you go to yours too now okay this is on

2493
01:49:26,680 --> 01:49:24,530
Twitter yeah

2494
01:49:31,420 --> 01:49:26,690
oh I see somebody posted Barry's way

2495
01:49:33,760 --> 01:49:31,430
Bravo yeah yeah I I'm not seeing it I'm

2496
01:49:36,010 --> 01:49:33,770
sorry to say I don't know why I'm on the

2497
01:49:38,620 --> 01:49:36,020
fade to black page right now but it's

2498
01:49:41,380 --> 01:49:38,630
right there go to your page and this is

2499
01:49:44,160 --> 01:49:41,390
live radio I apologize for Africa that's

2500
01:49:49,360 --> 01:49:44,170
okay folks you know we don't make it up

2501
01:49:52,230 --> 01:49:49,370
right right and I did like a week of

2502
01:49:56,410 --> 01:49:52,240
shows on this I had a bunch of people uh

2503
01:49:57,790 --> 01:49:56,420
okay well go and look for it during the

2504
01:50:00,670 --> 01:49:57,800
break and we'll come back to that but

2505
01:50:04,270 --> 01:50:00,680
when we talk about our occult and

2506
01:50:06,790 --> 01:50:04,280
occulted history um so much has been

2507
01:50:09,010 --> 01:50:06,800
made about Reagan let let me move

2508
01:50:12,250 --> 01:50:09,020
forward a little bit and as some of the

2509
01:50:15,730 --> 01:50:12,260
other sorry to interrupt you

2510
01:50:18,430 --> 01:50:15,740
apologies yeah okay yeah there we are

2511
01:50:20,830 --> 01:50:18,440
yeah those are great images they're

2512
01:50:24,010 --> 01:50:20,840
they're actually a nice tribute to

2513
01:50:26,800 --> 01:50:24,020
Pamela Coleman Smith's part but their

2514
01:50:28,360 --> 01:50:26,810
foreboding you know yeah well I want you

2515
01:50:30,850 --> 01:50:28,370
to take a look at this a little bit more

2516
01:50:33,070 --> 01:50:30,860
I want your comments on it because these

2517
01:50:36,340 --> 01:50:33,080
cards and you look at the star card

2518
01:50:38,860 --> 01:50:36,350
right and and what may be an asteroid

2519
01:50:40,870 --> 01:50:38,870
may it may be a comment I don't know but

2520
01:50:45,640 --> 01:50:40,880
each one of these stars has a face in it

2521
01:50:48,790 --> 01:50:45,650
and and so you need to kind of but every

2522
01:50:50,980 --> 01:50:48,800
one of these you can take a look and see

2523
01:50:53,050 --> 01:50:50,990
the meaning behind it it's it's pretty

2524
01:50:54,870 --> 01:50:53,060
in there we'll come back and I want you

2525
01:50:58,680 --> 01:50:54,880
know I want you to take a look at those

2526
01:51:02,590 --> 01:50:58,690
but what about the Clinton White House

2527
01:51:08,170 --> 01:51:02,600
mmm you know what about Bush one Bush

2528
01:51:10,270 --> 01:51:08,180
two Obama was there anything occulted

2529
01:51:10,570 --> 01:51:10,280
about those administrations or was there

2530
01:51:20,710 --> 01:51:10,580
any

2531
01:51:22,480 --> 01:51:20,720
contact oh did I lose Mitch Mitch you

2532
01:51:27,030 --> 01:51:22,490
have disappeared

2533
01:51:30,240 --> 01:51:27,040
did you hit mute on your microphone Oh

2534
01:51:38,110 --> 01:51:34,240
now that is absolute bizarro world right

2535
01:51:40,270 --> 01:51:38,120
there I've lost Mitch and I am just

2536
01:51:45,400 --> 01:51:40,280
gonna reset Mitch how's that

2537
01:51:47,950 --> 01:51:45,410
I mean mute and I am going to that's

2538
01:51:54,610 --> 01:51:47,960
that's bizarre just absolutely lost

2539
01:51:59,920 --> 01:51:54,620
Mitch completely huh

2540
01:52:03,940 --> 01:51:59,930
okay we'll see what's going on with that

2541
01:52:06,190 --> 01:52:03,950
that's a strange to have happen as I

2542
01:52:06,940 --> 01:52:06,200
whip out the I think it was the

2543
01:52:10,780 --> 01:52:06,950
Economist

2544
01:52:14,950 --> 01:52:10,790
a Rothschild publication actually yeah

2545
01:52:17,410 --> 01:52:14,960
we have lost Mitch we have lost Mitch to

2546
01:52:20,230 --> 01:52:17,420
to to to to to to to come on Mitch come

2547
01:52:25,900 --> 01:52:20,240
back to me something must have happened

2548
01:52:30,940 --> 01:52:25,910
on in it on his end okay that's that's a

2549
01:52:32,920 --> 01:52:30,950
strange that is very bizarre and what's

2550
01:52:36,120 --> 01:52:32,930
bizarre about it and you're watching me

2551
01:52:39,580 --> 01:52:36,130
right now is everything is solid

2552
01:52:43,990 --> 01:52:39,590
everything is solid everywhere except

2553
01:52:48,160 --> 01:52:44,000
for that yeah we have lost Mitch okay I

2554
01:52:50,380 --> 01:52:48,170
am going to alternate with this right

2555
01:52:53,080 --> 01:52:50,390
now and take a commercial break one

2556
01:52:56,170 --> 01:52:53,090
minute early and I will do everything to

2557
01:52:57,700 --> 01:52:56,180
get Mitch Horowitz back during this next

2558
01:53:00,640 --> 01:52:57,710
commercial break this is fade to black

2559
01:53:04,600 --> 01:53:00,650
our murals Jimmy Church I'm the game

2560
01:53:06,790 --> 01:53:04,610
changer Network in kg RA the planet

2561
01:53:08,830 --> 01:53:06,800
follow me on Twitter at gh radio you can

2562
01:53:10,600 --> 01:53:08,840
follow Mitch at Mitch Horowitz

2563
01:53:13,040 --> 01:53:10,610
this is fade to black and the game

2564
01:53:14,570 --> 01:53:13,050
changer Network in kg RA

2565
01:53:16,840 --> 01:53:14,580
the planet I'll be right back stay with

2566
01:53:27,450 --> 01:53:17,960
[Applause]

2567
01:53:33,280 --> 01:53:30,730
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[Music]

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your contact for current news and

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four four eight two no smartphone app or

2659
01:57:13,699 --> 01:57:11,459
Internet needed it saves your data plan

2660
01:57:17,089 --> 01:57:13,709
and no extra cost if you have unlimited

2661
01:57:19,370 --> 01:57:17,099
minutes just call six oh five five six

2662
01:57:21,799 --> 01:57:19,380
two four four eight two you can listen

2663
01:57:29,660 --> 01:57:21,809
to me Jimmy Church on any phone anytime

2664
01:57:33,709 --> 01:57:31,360
[Music]

2665
01:57:36,000 --> 01:57:33,719
[Applause]

2666
01:57:40,109 --> 01:57:36,010
you wanna know a secret

2667
01:57:43,050 --> 01:57:40,119
I love police I really love ponies I'm

2668
01:57:46,310 --> 01:57:43,060
serious I couldn't stay sane without

2669
01:57:52,839 --> 01:57:46,320
poor mr. Brooks why fade to black

2670
01:57:56,839 --> 01:57:54,680
this is fade to black

2671
01:58:00,500 --> 01:57:56,849
with Jimmy Church on the game changer

2672
01:58:07,720 --> 01:58:00,510
radio network at K GRA the global radio

2673
01:58:16,910 --> 01:58:14,830
[Music]

2674
01:58:19,010 --> 01:58:16,920
welcome back faith the black coming home

2675
01:58:23,270 --> 01:58:19,020
should be Church custom I'm Mitch

2676
01:58:27,350 --> 01:58:23,280
Horowitz amazing conversation can follow

2677
01:58:30,260 --> 01:58:27,360
me on twitter at JDO hashtag f2 B is the

2678
01:58:32,660 --> 01:58:30,270
sandbox Mitch Horowitz is there you can

2679
01:58:35,510 --> 01:58:32,670
follow Mitch admits a Mitch Horowitz and

2680
01:58:38,689 --> 01:58:35,520
now Mitch right before the break oh by

2681
01:58:46,010 --> 01:58:38,699
the way when I was sports casting yeah

2682
01:58:54,439 --> 01:58:46,020
never a technical glitch ever yes are

2683
01:58:58,220 --> 01:58:54,449
talking conspiracy theory I used to get

2684
01:59:03,350 --> 01:58:58,230
so upset and and it's just now it's what

2685
01:59:05,419 --> 01:59:03,360
whatever you know I I get it we our

2686
01:59:06,680 --> 01:59:05,429
latest series on History Channel

2687
01:59:09,590 --> 01:59:06,690
premiered a couple of weeks ago in the

2688
01:59:11,900 --> 01:59:09,600
in the first episode straight out went

2689
01:59:15,260 --> 01:59:11,910
straight at the CIA and I'm naming names

2690
01:59:17,510 --> 01:59:15,270
and government surveillance and and and

2691
01:59:20,060 --> 01:59:17,520
pokemons go and just just went straight

2692
01:59:23,660 --> 01:59:20,070
at and I thought I said to read I said

2693
01:59:27,890 --> 01:59:23,670
well if I wasn't on the radar I am now

2694
01:59:29,600 --> 01:59:27,900
so well say something I do a streaming a

2695
01:59:31,550 --> 01:59:29,610
talk show called one simple idea and I

2696
01:59:34,729 --> 01:59:31,560
was interviewing the channel or Paul

2697
01:59:36,020 --> 01:59:34,739
Selig was a good friend of mine and we

2698
01:59:38,030 --> 01:59:36,030
were shooting in the studio here in New

2699
01:59:40,040 --> 01:59:38,040
York City and the director was

2700
01:59:43,130 --> 01:59:40,050
absolutely shocked that after Paul and I

2701
01:59:46,160 --> 01:59:43,140
spoke for about one hour every source of

2702
01:59:48,740 --> 01:59:46,170
audio failed including a variety of

2703
01:59:50,390 --> 01:59:48,750
backups everything failed and he thought

2704
01:59:52,640 --> 01:59:50,400
they were some ghost in the machine and

2705
01:59:54,560 --> 01:59:52,650
Paul to his great credit came back the

2706
01:59:56,990 --> 01:59:54,570
very next day did the whole show over

2707
01:59:58,820 --> 01:59:57,000
with me but the director was absolutely

2708
02:00:02,330 --> 01:59:58,830
shocked because he had never seen every

2709
02:00:04,160 --> 02:00:02,340
fail-safe go bad and it just it all went

2710
02:00:06,290 --> 02:00:04,170
on the blank it was unprecedented I just

2711
02:00:07,220 --> 02:00:06,300
roll with the punches now that's happens

2712
02:00:12,160 --> 02:00:07,230
all I do yeah

2713
02:00:16,189 --> 02:00:12,170
now speaking of the Clintons when the

2714
02:00:18,770 --> 02:00:16,199
the factual side of Ronald and Nancy

2715
02:00:21,080 --> 02:00:18,780
Reagan and and their connections to this

2716
02:00:23,750 --> 02:00:21,090
ok that's documented but what about

2717
02:00:26,090 --> 02:00:23,760
everything after that anything else

2718
02:00:28,489 --> 02:00:26,100
bleed into the White House it got a lot

2719
02:00:30,500 --> 02:00:28,499
more boring after that you

2720
02:00:32,120 --> 02:00:30,510
Bill Clinton had been part of a Masonic

2721
02:00:36,229 --> 02:00:32,130
youth organization when he was a kid but

2722
02:00:37,729 --> 02:00:36,239
he never took free masonic rites obama

2723
02:00:39,290 --> 02:00:37,739
was interested in emerson and the

2724
02:00:41,330 --> 02:00:39,300
transcendentalist but you know there was

2725
02:00:44,029 --> 02:00:41,340
nothing that really went on there that

2726
02:00:46,100 --> 02:00:44,039
was unusual actually within george w

2727
02:00:47,719 --> 02:00:46,110
bush's Whitehouse there were some cool

2728
02:00:49,279 --> 02:00:47,729
stories about ghosts in the White House

2729
02:00:50,629 --> 02:00:49,289
that his daughters talked about and I

2730
02:00:52,640 --> 02:00:50,639
had posted about that on Facebook a

2731
02:00:53,989 --> 02:00:52,650
while ago actually so he had a couple of

2732
02:00:55,729 --> 02:00:53,999
good ghost stories that came out of

2733
02:00:58,989 --> 02:00:55,739
George HW Bush's White House then there

2734
02:01:01,250 --> 02:00:58,999
was a spurious story about Melania Trump

2735
02:01:03,589 --> 02:01:01,260
authorizing some sort of it exorcism in

2736
02:01:05,989 --> 02:01:03,599
the West Wing but that seems to be you

2737
02:01:07,910 --> 02:01:05,999
know just kind of made-up fantasy so

2738
02:01:09,799 --> 02:01:07,920
what we really need is a president who's

2739
02:01:11,359 --> 02:01:09,809
gonna bring all this stuff back into the

2740
02:01:14,120 --> 02:01:11,369
White House you know we need the Ouija

2741
02:01:15,350 --> 02:01:14,130
board and Jean Dixon the Masonic

2742
02:01:17,569 --> 02:01:15,360
connection back in the White House the

2743
02:01:20,600 --> 02:01:17,579
last president who is a full-fledged

2744
02:01:24,259 --> 02:01:20,610
freemason was the mysterious Gerald Ford

2745
02:01:25,879 --> 02:01:24,269
it was the very last one you know I I

2746
02:01:28,910 --> 02:01:25,889
enjoyed your comments earlier about

2747
02:01:31,370 --> 02:01:28,920
getting fired when you were doing you

2748
02:01:33,890 --> 02:01:31,380
know political stuff yes sir I mean you

2749
02:01:37,339 --> 02:01:33,900
know and that that's that's just awesome

2750
02:01:39,379 --> 02:01:37,349
and I don't do I don't do politics here

2751
02:01:41,479 --> 02:01:39,389
at all I do the conspiracy of politics

2752
02:01:45,620 --> 02:01:41,489
all day long but I just don't discuss

2753
02:01:48,620 --> 02:01:45,630
politics but here we are today we've

2754
02:01:51,439 --> 02:01:48,630
always wanted disclosure this community

2755
02:01:53,299 --> 02:01:51,449
wants these subjects discuss they want

2756
02:01:57,379 --> 02:01:53,309
confirmation from the very highest

2757
02:02:01,699 --> 02:01:57,389
offices and and now we have a president

2758
02:02:04,219 --> 02:02:01,709
who is fully embracing every conspiracy

2759
02:02:07,100 --> 02:02:04,229
theory we've ever thought about right

2760
02:02:11,120 --> 02:02:07,110
and it's it's like be careful what you

2761
02:02:12,709 --> 02:02:11,130
wish for yeah and and so when you're

2762
02:02:14,629 --> 02:02:12,719
talking about we need it back in the

2763
02:02:16,419 --> 02:02:14,639
White House I wouldn't doubt it if

2764
02:02:19,669 --> 02:02:16,429
there's a Ouija board over there now

2765
02:02:21,379 --> 02:02:19,679
well you know I think if the occult and

2766
02:02:23,000 --> 02:02:21,389
conspiracy theories is different things

2767
02:02:25,370 --> 02:02:23,010
you know people tend to get into this

2768
02:02:27,739 --> 02:02:25,380
us-versus-them mindset with conspiracy

2769
02:02:29,299 --> 02:02:27,749
theories whereas the occult my hope is

2770
02:02:31,850 --> 02:02:29,309
that what we're really doing is

2771
02:02:35,299 --> 02:02:31,860
searching for an unseen world and an

2772
02:02:37,609 --> 02:02:35,309
unseen world whose forces and and and

2773
02:02:38,839 --> 02:02:37,619
and properties can be felt on us and

2774
02:02:40,880 --> 02:02:38,849
through us you know it's it's really

2775
02:02:42,590 --> 02:02:40,890
part of the individual search

2776
02:02:46,070 --> 02:02:42,600
I don't think much of that is going out

2777
02:02:48,010 --> 02:02:46,080
on the west wing right now to put it

2778
02:02:50,750 --> 02:02:48,020
mildly

2779
02:02:52,970 --> 02:02:50,760
see and I'm almost nervous just even

2780
02:02:55,940 --> 02:02:52,980
talking about it a little bit you know

2781
02:02:59,660 --> 02:02:55,950
it's it's it's a strange time that we

2782
02:03:03,890 --> 02:02:59,670
live in right now I feel this shift yeah

2783
02:03:06,350 --> 02:03:03,900
you know I really do I really do and I'm

2784
02:03:11,660 --> 02:03:06,360
gonna stay right on this though if we

2785
02:03:15,590 --> 02:03:11,670
can the the other part of life that for

2786
02:03:20,180 --> 02:03:15,600
me is is becoming a reality is when you

2787
02:03:23,900 --> 02:03:20,190
have Silicon Valley heads of companies

2788
02:03:26,870 --> 02:03:23,910
you know Elon Musk you know pick pick

2789
02:03:29,090 --> 02:03:26,880
some you know enterpreneur out of

2790
02:03:32,330 --> 02:03:29,100
Silicon Valley right now that is talking

2791
02:03:36,080 --> 02:03:32,340
about a holographic situation or that

2792
02:03:38,540 --> 02:03:36,090
we're living in some type of computer

2793
02:03:41,660 --> 02:03:38,550
simulation in that life is ones and

2794
02:03:43,250 --> 02:03:41,670
zeros when we talk about that they know

2795
02:03:56,320 --> 02:03:43,260
something about quantum theory and

2796
02:04:00,730 --> 02:03:56,330
quantum mechanics and quantum mechanic

2797
02:04:04,670 --> 02:04:00,740
everything Tarot Ouija life-after-death

2798
02:04:06,710 --> 02:04:04,680
parallel worlds it's all be a reality

2799
02:04:09,110 --> 02:04:06,720
for us and the rest of the world is

2800
02:04:11,870 --> 02:04:09,120
going to have to accept it you know the

2801
02:04:15,830 --> 02:04:11,880
Achilles heel I think of the Silicon

2802
02:04:17,570 --> 02:04:15,840
Valley mindset is this these guys have a

2803
02:04:19,430 --> 02:04:17,580
certain degree of hubris where they like

2804
02:04:21,860 --> 02:04:19,440
talking about the idea let's say

2805
02:04:26,240 --> 02:04:21,870
creating a thinking machine and they

2806
02:04:30,380 --> 02:04:26,250
like comparing binary code and the

2807
02:04:33,290 --> 02:04:30,390
manipulation of binary code to some kind

2808
02:04:36,530 --> 02:04:33,300
of deific act of creation but the truth

2809
02:04:39,020 --> 02:04:36,540
is we can't even define consciousness

2810
02:04:42,260 --> 02:04:39,030
itself you I've never heard a definition

2811
02:04:46,040 --> 02:04:42,270
of consciousness that adequately covers

2812
02:04:49,190 --> 02:04:46,050
all the bases because as we were talking

2813
02:04:50,960 --> 02:04:49,200
about at the top of the show we grew up

2814
02:04:53,300 --> 02:04:50,970
in a world where consciousness was

2815
02:04:54,800 --> 02:04:53,310
really thought to be a phenomenon that

2816
02:04:57,760 --> 02:04:54,810
grew out of the gray matter of the

2817
02:05:05,180 --> 02:04:57,770
we are discovering beyond testimony

2818
02:05:06,680 --> 02:05:05,190
actual clinical data and information

2819
02:05:10,120 --> 02:05:06,690
gathering that demonstrates that

2820
02:05:13,340 --> 02:05:10,130
consciousness is also extra physical and

2821
02:05:16,160 --> 02:05:13,350
the idea of what thought is what

2822
02:05:18,860 --> 02:05:16,170
awareness is what consciousness is has

2823
02:05:21,320 --> 02:05:18,870
been challenged by 80 years of quantum

2824
02:05:25,180 --> 02:05:21,330
physics experiments has been challenged

2825
02:05:29,210 --> 02:05:25,190
by neuroplasticity by psychical research

2826
02:05:31,070 --> 02:05:29,220
by really deepening mysteries around the

2827
02:05:33,560 --> 02:05:31,080
placebo response right now which we

2828
02:05:35,030 --> 02:05:33,570
haven't even touched upon so these guys

2829
02:05:37,460 --> 02:05:35,040
are talking about the prospect of

2830
02:05:40,100 --> 02:05:37,470
creating Thinking Machines but we don't

2831
02:05:41,990 --> 02:05:40,110
even know what thinking is and I think

2832
02:05:44,180 --> 02:05:42,000
there's almost like this Titanic like

2833
02:05:47,270 --> 02:05:44,190
quality where we're developing this

2834
02:05:50,810 --> 02:05:47,280
sense that we can create something and

2835
02:05:52,910 --> 02:05:50,820
yet we haven't even defined what it is

2836
02:05:55,580 --> 02:05:52,920
that that we're creating there's this

2837
02:05:59,120 --> 02:05:55,590
Frankenstein like quality to some of

2838
02:06:02,000 --> 02:05:59,130
this reasoning there is and the the

2839
02:06:04,340 --> 02:06:02,010
other part so this is for me this is

2840
02:06:07,550 --> 02:06:04,350
what I find fascinating we touched upon

2841
02:06:10,070 --> 02:06:07,560
it earlier where there there's a very

2842
02:06:13,760 --> 02:06:10,080
large part of this planet that isn't

2843
02:06:15,710 --> 02:06:13,770
concerned about anything fantastical is

2844
02:06:18,850 --> 02:06:15,720
not they're completely focused on the

2845
02:06:20,900 --> 02:06:18,860
status quo we it's fine but it's also

2846
02:06:25,910 --> 02:06:20,910
indoctrination it's it's what we've been

2847
02:06:29,960 --> 02:06:25,920
taught but if if something breaks where

2848
02:06:34,040 --> 02:06:29,970
even those the very pragmatic is forced

2849
02:06:37,040 --> 02:06:34,050
into a whole nother paradigm shift is

2850
02:06:38,600 --> 02:06:37,050
that dangerous I mean I mean seriously

2851
02:06:42,680 --> 02:06:38,610
are we talking about people jumping off

2852
02:06:44,960 --> 02:06:42,690
of buildings because all of their belief

2853
02:06:48,320 --> 02:06:44,970
systems are broken down yeah it's an

2854
02:06:49,880 --> 02:06:48,330
interesting question I mean you know we

2855
02:06:52,100 --> 02:06:49,890
don't know because it's so unprecedented

2856
02:06:54,650 --> 02:06:52,110
you know there's things that happen that

2857
02:06:57,280 --> 02:06:54,660
have never happened before and we don't

2858
02:06:59,660 --> 02:06:57,290
know what the human effect is gonna be

2859
02:07:02,510 --> 02:06:59,670
because because nothing like it has

2860
02:07:04,490 --> 02:07:02,520
occurred before you know I mean 9/11 was

2861
02:07:06,320 --> 02:07:04,500
unprecedented the Titanic was

2862
02:07:08,220 --> 02:07:06,330
unprecedented Darwinism was

2863
02:07:10,170 --> 02:07:08,230
unprecedented the moonshot

2864
02:07:12,050 --> 02:07:10,180
was unprecedented you know we don't know

2865
02:07:14,310 --> 02:07:12,060
how the human psyche is going to be

2866
02:07:16,560 --> 02:07:14,320
affected simply because it hasn't

2867
02:07:19,080 --> 02:07:16,570
happened before but I do feel very

2868
02:07:22,020 --> 02:07:19,090
strongly that our generation and it's

2869
02:07:25,440 --> 02:07:22,030
exciting to me and hopefully exciting in

2870
02:07:28,950 --> 02:07:25,450
a positive way our generation is facing

2871
02:07:30,540 --> 02:07:28,960
the prospect that our idea of what it

2872
02:07:33,720 --> 02:07:30,550
means to be human of what it means to

2873
02:07:35,729 --> 02:07:33,730
think is being upended placebo studies

2874
02:07:37,920 --> 02:07:35,739
alone are doing that I mean we're seeing

2875
02:07:39,900 --> 02:07:37,930
successful placebo surgeries being

2876
02:07:42,300 --> 02:07:39,910
performed quite literally replacing

2877
02:07:45,030 --> 02:07:42,310
spectroscopic knee surgery for people

2878
02:07:47,790 --> 02:07:45,040
with arthritic knees we're seeing

2879
02:07:50,910 --> 02:07:47,800
placebo studies that demonstrate people

2880
02:07:53,460 --> 02:07:50,920
actually being able to lose weight or

2881
02:07:54,870 --> 02:07:53,470
increase their vital bodily functions

2882
02:07:58,290 --> 02:07:54,880
because they've been told that their

2883
02:08:00,979 --> 02:07:58,300
jobs are aerobic Lior anaerobically

2884
02:08:04,200 --> 02:08:00,989
beneficial just information itself

2885
02:08:06,690 --> 02:08:04,210
changes physical matter perception

2886
02:08:10,170 --> 02:08:06,700
changes what happens within our body

2887
02:08:12,000 --> 02:08:10,180
chemistry and that barn door cannot be

2888
02:08:13,680 --> 02:08:12,010
shut again that simply cannot be shut

2889
02:08:15,900 --> 02:08:13,690
again where we're coming to understand

2890
02:08:19,380 --> 02:08:15,910
the mind is having extra physical

2891
02:08:25,050 --> 02:08:19,390
qualities how do we how do we convince

2892
02:08:27,600 --> 02:08:25,060
you know because many have talked about

2893
02:08:30,690 --> 02:08:27,610
magic or the power of the mind or Teleca

2894
02:08:34,200 --> 02:08:30,700
you know all of this is has been part of

2895
02:08:36,750 --> 02:08:34,210
the mythology Hollywood right and was so

2896
02:08:39,600 --> 02:08:36,760
well familiar with it but what does it

2897
02:08:42,680 --> 02:08:39,610
take to to cross the line to take the

2898
02:08:44,850 --> 02:08:42,690
next step does it have to be science

2899
02:08:47,250 --> 02:08:44,860
that's an interesting question you know

2900
02:08:48,720 --> 02:08:47,260
I mean you have a portion of our culture

2901
02:08:52,710 --> 02:08:48,730
and sometimes they call themselves

2902
02:08:55,440 --> 02:08:52,720
skeptics but what they really are they

2903
02:08:57,900 --> 02:08:55,450
are dedicated to the elimination of a

2904
02:08:59,340 --> 02:08:57,910
certain class of questions like the

2905
02:09:01,020 --> 02:08:59,350
questions that you and I are discussing

2906
02:09:02,310 --> 02:09:01,030
right now what are the extra physical

2907
02:09:04,229 --> 02:09:02,320
properties of the mind what do we

2908
02:09:06,690 --> 02:09:04,239
understand how do we deepen that

2909
02:09:09,180 --> 02:09:06,700
question where do we go there's a core

2910
02:09:11,820 --> 02:09:09,190
of people in our culture today who don't

2911
02:09:13,830 --> 02:09:11,830
want to have a debate and and win you

2912
02:09:16,590 --> 02:09:13,840
know like win for the materialist side

2913
02:09:18,150 --> 02:09:16,600
they want to eliminate the debate they

2914
02:09:20,580 --> 02:09:18,160
don't feel that this discussion we're

2915
02:09:21,630 --> 02:09:20,590
having for example should have any place

2916
02:09:23,370 --> 02:09:21,640
with

2917
02:09:25,500 --> 02:09:23,380
mainstream media should have any place

2918
02:09:27,000 --> 02:09:25,510
within scholarship any place within

2919
02:09:29,220 --> 02:09:27,010
college campuses and they've been very

2920
02:09:30,780 --> 02:09:29,230
successful so you have a section of our

2921
02:09:33,000 --> 02:09:30,790
culture that's dedicated not to

2922
02:09:35,670 --> 02:09:33,010
skepticism which is actually the art of

2923
02:09:37,530 --> 02:09:35,680
questioning but to a shutting down of

2924
02:09:39,330 --> 02:09:37,540
questioning and when you have that

2925
02:09:41,220 --> 02:09:39,340
mindset that there are certain questions

2926
02:09:43,200 --> 02:09:41,230
that shouldn't be asked when you can't

2927
02:09:44,550 --> 02:09:43,210
ask the basic human question what's

2928
02:09:46,980 --> 02:09:44,560
around the hill what's around the next

2929
02:09:50,310 --> 02:09:46,990
corner regardless of how meticulous your

2930
02:09:52,680 --> 02:09:50,320
methods are or from how calm and sober

2931
02:09:54,450 --> 02:09:52,690
an intellectual perspective you come you

2932
02:09:56,670 --> 02:09:54,460
have a kind of anti-intellectualism and

2933
02:09:58,470 --> 02:09:56,680
it's powerful in our culture today

2934
02:10:00,540 --> 02:09:58,480
that's why there's not more good ESP

2935
02:10:04,200 --> 02:10:00,550
research going on on college campuses

2936
02:10:07,890 --> 02:10:04,210
for example now I have to ask you this

2937
02:10:12,390 --> 02:10:07,900
popped up earlier what about yourself

2938
02:10:16,920 --> 02:10:12,400
and the other things that are being

2939
02:10:20,190 --> 02:10:16,930
discussed today such as ayahuasca DMT

2940
02:10:22,110 --> 02:10:20,200
and and that part of it and I think

2941
02:10:25,830 --> 02:10:22,120
scientifically that needs to be

2942
02:10:29,370 --> 02:10:25,840
researched actually speaking of that but

2943
02:10:32,430 --> 02:10:29,380
yeah what about you have you have you

2944
02:10:34,410 --> 02:10:32,440
done any psychedelic research no I

2945
02:10:37,670 --> 02:10:34,420
haven't and I plan to get more into that

2946
02:10:40,020 --> 02:10:37,680
in this second half of my life actually

2947
02:10:42,720 --> 02:10:40,030
experimenting with psychedelics has not

2948
02:10:44,490 --> 02:10:42,730
been part of my experience but I'm

2949
02:10:47,190 --> 02:10:44,500
thinking probably over the next year or

2950
02:10:49,440 --> 02:10:47,200
so that's a direction in which I'm going

2951
02:10:50,820 --> 02:10:49,450
to go I think it's very important and I

2952
02:10:52,500 --> 02:10:50,830
think the scholarship that's coming out

2953
02:10:56,910 --> 02:10:52,510
of that is it's really wonderful I

2954
02:11:01,710 --> 02:10:56,920
wanted to touch upon your your comments

2955
02:11:04,110 --> 02:11:01,720
about religion and it's such a broad you

2956
02:11:07,560 --> 02:11:04,120
spend a lot of time discussing this but

2957
02:11:11,450 --> 02:11:07,570
like I want to narrow this down when we

2958
02:11:14,640 --> 02:11:11,460
are talking about contact with

2959
02:11:19,160 --> 02:11:14,650
information and I'm going back 5,000

2960
02:11:22,710 --> 02:11:19,170
years 4,000 years 3000 years whenever

2961
02:11:26,930 --> 02:11:22,720
somebody needs to communicate back to

2962
02:11:32,640 --> 02:11:26,940
the village about something it's always

2963
02:11:34,500 --> 02:11:32,650
God said God spoke and where do you

2964
02:11:35,129 --> 02:11:34,510
think that because they're talking about

2965
02:11:36,359 --> 02:11:35,139
getting a

2966
02:11:40,529 --> 02:11:36,369
from the heavens they're getting it from

2967
02:11:42,409 --> 02:11:40,539
the stars and every every form of

2968
02:11:44,939 --> 02:11:42,419
religion has had this type of

2969
02:11:48,810 --> 02:11:44,949
communication that they bring back to

2970
02:11:52,229 --> 02:11:48,820
the masses is there is there a watered

2971
02:11:53,819 --> 02:11:52,239
down singular source of this information

2972
02:11:56,580 --> 02:11:53,829
because it doesn't matter if we're

2973
02:11:58,979 --> 02:11:56,590
talking about Catholicism or or what was

2974
02:12:04,319 --> 02:11:58,989
going on with the Pharaohs and ancient

2975
02:12:08,489 --> 02:12:04,329
gods of Egypt or yes or Greece or Islam

2976
02:12:10,409 --> 02:12:08,499
it was it doesn't matter what do you

2977
02:12:12,469 --> 02:12:10,419
think actually is going on here is there

2978
02:12:15,389 --> 02:12:12,479
one source of information that has been

2979
02:12:17,459 --> 02:12:15,399
coming back to us that's a wonderful

2980
02:12:19,649 --> 02:12:17,469
question and of course it's really the

2981
02:12:21,989 --> 02:12:19,659
ultimate mystery you know is there a

2982
02:12:25,830 --> 02:12:21,999
single source I mean my my impression is

2983
02:12:28,639 --> 02:12:25,840
based on people's experiences testimony

2984
02:12:31,739 --> 02:12:28,649
my own experiences the historical record

2985
02:12:34,109 --> 02:12:31,749
we live under complex of laws and forces

2986
02:12:36,870 --> 02:12:34,119
and I think these things express

2987
02:12:38,699 --> 02:12:36,880
themselves to us in the form of deity in

2988
02:12:41,129 --> 02:12:38,709
the form of channeled information in the

2989
02:12:43,409 --> 02:12:41,139
form of angels in the form of ESP

2990
02:12:45,600 --> 02:12:43,419
transmissions in the form of symbols in

2991
02:12:47,819 --> 02:12:45,610
the form of synchronicities it seems to

2992
02:12:51,419 --> 02:12:47,829
me that there's this whole extra

2993
02:12:53,639 --> 02:12:51,429
physical dimension to life and its

2994
02:12:55,919 --> 02:12:53,649
forces are felt on us or felt through us

2995
02:12:57,870 --> 02:12:55,929
sometimes people call it God sometimes

2996
02:13:01,620 --> 02:12:57,880
people call it synchronicity sometimes

2997
02:13:03,600 --> 02:13:01,630
people call it you know the source was

2998
02:13:06,299 --> 02:13:03,610
the term that you're Cayce used my

2999
02:13:08,250 --> 02:13:06,309
friend Paul Selig who's channeler refers

3000
02:13:11,939 --> 02:13:08,260
to the guides you know what what are

3001
02:13:13,469 --> 02:13:11,949
these extra physical intelligences and

3002
02:13:15,149 --> 02:13:13,479
somebody could say well you know they're

3003
02:13:16,979 --> 02:13:15,159
just the human psyche but how that

3004
02:13:18,419 --> 02:13:16,989
deepens our questions about the human

3005
02:13:20,850 --> 02:13:18,429
psyche then you know maybe there's this

3006
02:13:22,560 --> 02:13:20,860
extra physical quality to the human

3007
02:13:24,479 --> 02:13:22,570
psyche that's not bound by the five

3008
02:13:26,729 --> 02:13:24,489
senses it seems impossible to conclude

3009
02:13:29,009 --> 02:13:26,739
otherwise given the information that we

3010
02:13:32,639 --> 02:13:29,019
have today so you know what we know is

3011
02:13:35,310 --> 02:13:32,649
that we are these extrasensory beings we

3012
02:13:39,120 --> 02:13:35,320
have an intellect that goes beyond

3013
02:13:40,830 --> 02:13:39,130
cognition and motor function and it

3014
02:13:43,139 --> 02:13:40,840
throws open the door to all these

3015
02:13:45,029 --> 02:13:43,149
questions you know our for example if

3016
02:13:47,819 --> 02:13:45,039
someone speaks in terms of an angel or a

3017
02:13:48,540 --> 02:13:47,829
demon are those actual entities or are

3018
02:13:51,540 --> 02:13:48,550
those just

3019
02:13:53,220 --> 02:13:51,550
ways that we process non-physical

3020
02:13:55,680 --> 02:13:53,230
information and experiences that are

3021
02:13:57,720 --> 02:13:55,690
reaching us whether there's one source I

3022
02:13:59,970 --> 02:13:57,730
have no idea you know whether these

3023
02:14:02,490 --> 02:13:59,980
things are different distinct personas

3024
02:14:04,680 --> 02:14:02,500
Casey had a source my friend Paul has

3025
02:14:08,460 --> 02:14:04,690
the guides people speak in terms of

3026
02:14:12,180 --> 02:14:08,470
angels demons God Satan I I suspect

3027
02:14:14,820 --> 02:14:12,190
somehow all of this must converge on on

3028
02:14:16,530 --> 02:14:14,830
one point but we experience it in these

3029
02:14:19,230 --> 02:14:16,540
different ways and I think many

3030
02:14:21,030 --> 02:14:19,240
different energies and laws rule over us

3031
02:14:23,970 --> 02:14:21,040
and kind of criss cross through us yeah

3032
02:14:28,230 --> 02:14:23,980
and that that mindset which makes a lot

3033
02:14:29,820 --> 02:14:28,240
of sense today that is a life of torture

3034
02:14:32,340 --> 02:14:29,830
and being burned at the stake in the

3035
02:14:34,470 --> 02:14:32,350
past I mean well you can't even

3036
02:14:36,150 --> 02:14:34,480
contemplate those kind of thoughts it's

3037
02:14:38,070 --> 02:14:36,160
it's it's extraordinary you know people

3038
02:14:40,200 --> 02:14:38,080
talk about Freemasonry for example as a

3039
02:14:41,820 --> 02:14:40,210
secret society and some people have

3040
02:14:44,070 --> 02:14:41,830
these sinister notions around it you

3041
02:14:46,170 --> 02:14:44,080
know Masons had very good reasons to

3042
02:14:48,750 --> 02:14:46,180
maintain confidentiality about what they

3043
02:14:53,310 --> 02:14:48,760
were doing because as masonry emerged

3044
02:14:55,710 --> 02:14:53,320
above-ground in the early 1700s and and

3045
02:14:59,490 --> 02:14:55,720
you could trace some of its veritable

3046
02:15:02,610 --> 02:14:59,500
routes to the 1600s and earlier to run

3047
02:15:04,680 --> 02:15:02,620
afoul of state-sponsored religion could

3048
02:15:07,260 --> 02:15:04,690
mean losing your head literally could

3049
02:15:08,880 --> 02:15:07,270
mean going to jail there were very good

3050
02:15:11,400 --> 02:15:08,890
reasons for certain clandestine

3051
02:15:13,860 --> 02:15:11,410
societies where the Rosicrucians or

3052
02:15:15,780 --> 02:15:13,870
Freemasons or the short-lived Illuminati

3053
02:15:17,250 --> 02:15:15,790
to be secretive because they were

3054
02:15:19,380 --> 02:15:17,260
dealing with ideas that were heretical

3055
02:15:21,480 --> 02:15:19,390
and that would have resulted in death

3056
02:15:22,980 --> 02:15:21,490
sentences in certain cases and I think

3057
02:15:24,870 --> 02:15:22,990
we should take different stock of these

3058
02:15:26,910 --> 02:15:24,880
groups and realize that to some extent

3059
02:15:28,860 --> 02:15:26,920
they helped plant seeds for the

3060
02:15:32,730 --> 02:15:28,870
spiritual counterculture that we're

3061
02:15:34,820 --> 02:15:32,740
beneficiaries of today they're what I'm

3062
02:15:38,850 --> 02:15:34,830
gonna switch over to your book because

3063
02:15:42,210 --> 02:15:38,860
as I was reading through it one chapter

3064
02:15:44,040 --> 02:15:42,220
I read a couple of times which was the

3065
02:15:47,340 --> 02:15:44,050
ethic of getting rich and don't laugh

3066
02:15:51,750 --> 02:15:47,350
yet okay because then it's a great

3067
02:15:54,300 --> 02:15:51,760
chapter and I need your comments on your

3068
02:15:56,690 --> 02:15:54,310
opening paragraph here and I want the

3069
02:15:59,790 --> 02:15:56,700
audience to listen really closely you

3070
02:16:02,160 --> 02:15:59,800
right there is a conflict in the early

3071
02:16:05,550 --> 02:16:02,170
21st century new thought

3072
02:16:08,400 --> 02:16:05,560
some seekers want to want a new thought

3073
02:16:11,010 --> 02:16:08,410
that emphasizes personal attainment and

3074
02:16:14,100 --> 02:16:11,020
ambition others believe that new

3075
02:16:16,950 --> 02:16:14,110
thoughts focus should be on social

3076
02:16:21,230 --> 02:16:16,960
justice they view the Think and Grow

3077
02:16:22,410 --> 02:16:21,240
Rich approach as narrow unspiritual or

3078
02:16:24,630 --> 02:16:22,420
outdated

3079
02:16:27,780 --> 02:16:24,640
that's about as powerful as anything

3080
02:16:31,470 --> 02:16:27,790
that could be in in a book let alone an

3081
02:16:33,990 --> 02:16:31,480
opening chapter in a book now I need you

3082
02:16:36,690 --> 02:16:34,000
to explain what your where your going

3083
02:16:38,130 --> 02:16:36,700
with this well within the positive

3084
02:16:40,190 --> 02:16:38,140
thinking movement within the new thought

3085
02:16:42,810 --> 02:16:40,200
movement within the law of attraction

3086
02:16:44,640 --> 02:16:42,820
culture people have debates as to

3087
02:16:47,490 --> 02:16:44,650
whether the mind should be used as a

3088
02:16:49,950 --> 02:16:47,500
tool for social justice beneficence

3089
02:16:54,270 --> 02:16:49,960
community building or frankly as a get

3090
02:16:56,430 --> 02:16:54,280
rich tool and the truth is you know I

3091
02:16:57,900 --> 02:16:56,440
really honor personal aspiration I

3092
02:17:00,240 --> 02:16:57,910
really believe in the sacredness of

3093
02:17:01,620 --> 02:17:00,250
individual ambition I think that

3094
02:17:03,240 --> 02:17:01,630
somebody who wants to start a business

3095
02:17:06,090 --> 02:17:03,250
or somebody who wants to attain

3096
02:17:09,419 --> 02:17:06,100
financial independence is moved very

3097
02:17:12,360 --> 02:17:09,429
often by values that are just as as deep

3098
02:17:14,280 --> 02:17:12,370
and just as generative as as those

3099
02:17:16,800 --> 02:17:14,290
values that that go under the term

3100
02:17:19,140 --> 02:17:16,810
social justice or community building I

3101
02:17:21,150 --> 02:17:19,150
really honor human aspiration and I

3102
02:17:25,080 --> 02:17:21,160
don't think it's contradictory to use

3103
02:17:29,370 --> 02:17:25,090
spiritual or metaphysical ends to as a

3104
02:17:31,290 --> 02:17:29,380
means towards self-expression whether in

3105
02:17:32,790 --> 02:17:31,300
an artistic sense or whether in a

3106
02:17:34,410 --> 02:17:32,800
commercial sense I don't want people to

3107
02:17:36,030 --> 02:17:34,420
feel embarrassed by that I do think we

3108
02:17:38,400 --> 02:17:36,040
are here to be generative we are to be

3109
02:17:42,300 --> 02:17:38,410
productive we are here to build and I

3110
02:17:45,000 --> 02:17:42,310
don't want to draw lines between what is

3111
02:17:46,740 --> 02:17:45,010
sometimes considered a proper spiritual

3112
02:17:49,470 --> 02:17:46,750
goal versus what is sometimes considered

3113
02:17:52,020 --> 02:17:49,480
a consumerist goal you know I think that

3114
02:17:53,760 --> 02:17:52,030
these these lines can become kind of

3115
02:17:57,360 --> 02:17:53,770
artificial they they can become an

3116
02:17:59,459 --> 02:17:57,370
orthodoxy of their own I honor I honor

3117
02:18:02,610 --> 02:17:59,469
the impulse of human attainment I honor

3118
02:18:04,620 --> 02:18:02,620
the impulse of the wish for human

3119
02:18:06,450 --> 02:18:04,630
improvement and self-development and I

3120
02:18:09,510 --> 02:18:06,460
think spirituality can be used for those

3121
02:18:09,900 --> 02:18:09,520
ends ok you can have both you can have

3122
02:18:13,780 --> 02:18:09,910
both

3123
02:18:19,540 --> 02:18:13,790
absolutely you know if if you go and

3124
02:18:23,740 --> 02:18:19,550
your goal is to solve the water issues

3125
02:18:26,799 --> 02:18:23,750
in Africa right and and you want to do

3126
02:18:30,370 --> 02:18:26,809
that and and and you succeed in

3127
02:18:33,250 --> 02:18:30,380
inventing or solving that issue and you

3128
02:18:37,089 --> 02:18:33,260
get rich off of it wait a minute

3129
02:18:39,850 --> 02:18:37,099
what what see I don't see it just long

3130
02:18:42,070 --> 02:18:39,860
as you don't change as a person I want

3131
02:18:44,110 --> 02:18:42,080
to break down all these kind of barriers

3132
02:18:46,690 --> 02:18:44,120
that we seek to put up between inner

3133
02:18:50,290 --> 02:18:46,700
experience how to experience personality

3134
02:18:51,970 --> 02:18:50,300
essence self seeking community building

3135
02:18:55,360 --> 02:18:51,980
these things are all sort of one

3136
02:18:59,020 --> 02:18:55,370
continuous sphere of life in a certain

3137
02:19:01,270 --> 02:18:59,030
sense and what's really important to my

3138
02:19:03,459 --> 02:19:01,280
mind is that the individual will come in

3139
02:19:06,600 --> 02:19:03,469
touch with and feel that he or she is

3140
02:19:09,940 --> 02:19:06,610
moving towards some sense of ethical

3141
02:19:11,830 --> 02:19:09,950
attainment and I I do think that the

3142
02:19:15,190 --> 02:19:11,840
individual will never be happy really

3143
02:19:17,890 --> 02:19:15,200
unless he or she feels some sort of

3144
02:19:20,290 --> 02:19:17,900
progressive momentum towards a

3145
02:19:23,049 --> 02:19:20,300
deep-seated personal goal and that can

3146
02:19:25,870 --> 02:19:23,059
take any number of forms have you found

3147
02:19:28,600 --> 02:19:25,880
your bliss I have found my bliss in

3148
02:19:30,490 --> 02:19:28,610
documenting metaphysical experience both

3149
02:19:32,650 --> 02:19:30,500
in history and in practice what you and

3150
02:19:36,339 --> 02:19:32,660
I are doing together on this show is my

3151
02:19:39,400 --> 02:19:36,349
bliss the the issue that I have I want

3152
02:19:43,540 --> 02:19:39,410
your comment on this because your your

3153
02:19:46,780 --> 02:19:43,550
take on religion is infectious so and I

3154
02:19:49,120 --> 02:19:46,790
I seriously suggest that everybody

3155
02:19:51,761 --> 02:19:49,130
listening right now go and chase down

3156
02:19:53,920 --> 02:19:51,771
some of Mitch's presentations online

3157
02:19:56,950 --> 02:19:53,930
there they're unbelievably great to

3158
02:20:04,390 --> 02:19:56,960
watch but that being said what I do have

3159
02:20:08,340 --> 02:20:04,400
issues with is a preacher that needs a

3160
02:20:12,340 --> 02:20:08,350
g5 to fly around the world

3161
02:20:14,650 --> 02:20:12,350
read the message and he needs your money

3162
02:20:18,970 --> 02:20:14,660
from people that may need their money to

3163
02:20:23,560 --> 02:20:18,980
eat but he needs it from you so he can

3164
02:20:24,881 --> 02:20:23,570
buy a g5 if you are going to need to

3165
02:20:27,700 --> 02:20:24,891
spread

3166
02:20:31,631 --> 02:20:27,710
the word whatever it is around the world

3167
02:20:35,921 --> 02:20:31,641
I think you can fly coach yeah this

3168
02:20:37,660 --> 02:20:35,931
there's always been this this Academy or

3169
02:20:40,211 --> 02:20:37,670
this tension between religion and money

3170
02:20:43,360 --> 02:20:40,221
and today of course the prosperity

3171
02:20:47,230 --> 02:20:43,370
gospel is one of the most popular forms

3172
02:20:49,211 --> 02:20:47,240
of Protestantism and I'm a half-wave

3173
02:20:50,251 --> 02:20:49,221
defender of the prosperity gospel to the

3174
02:20:52,240 --> 02:20:50,261
extent that there are these different

3175
02:20:56,291 --> 02:20:52,250
iterations of it I mean within that

3176
02:20:59,200 --> 02:20:56,301
world you have figures who are nobler

3177
02:21:02,890 --> 02:20:59,210
and you have figures who are kind of

3178
02:21:04,331 --> 02:21:02,900
coarse or cut from a lower cloth and you

3179
02:21:06,310 --> 02:21:04,341
know some some of the people in the

3180
02:21:08,381 --> 02:21:06,320
prosperity gospel world some of the

3181
02:21:10,720 --> 02:21:08,391
ministers in the prosperity gospel world

3182
02:21:13,211 --> 02:21:10,730
they are responsible people they don't

3183
02:21:14,950 --> 02:21:13,221
solicit ruinous sums of money from their

3184
02:21:17,171 --> 02:21:14,960
congregants and the Condry can stick

3185
02:21:19,030 --> 02:21:17,181
around because they feel that they are

3186
02:21:22,030 --> 02:21:19,040
receiving something then you have other

3187
02:21:24,640 --> 02:21:22,040
figures who emphasize a great deal of

3188
02:21:25,751 --> 02:21:24,650
clash and their message is not one that

3189
02:21:27,940 --> 02:21:25,761
resonates with me

3190
02:21:30,011 --> 02:21:27,950
I'm not into Benny Hinn I'm not into

3191
02:21:32,230 --> 02:21:30,021
creflo dollar but then you have a figure

3192
02:21:34,211 --> 02:21:32,240
like TD jakes who's kind of loosely

3193
02:21:35,921 --> 02:21:34,221
associated with the prosperity gospel or

3194
02:21:37,900 --> 02:21:35,931
even the dreaded Joel Osteen who people

3195
02:21:41,020 --> 02:21:37,910
make fun of all the time but a lot of

3196
02:21:43,930 --> 02:21:41,030
Joel's advice actually I think resonates

3197
02:21:47,280 --> 02:21:43,940
with people's common sense need to find

3198
02:21:50,980 --> 02:21:47,290
practical solutions within religion so I

3199
02:21:52,751 --> 02:21:50,990
I'm a defender of his basically and I

3200
02:21:54,610 --> 02:21:52,761
think there's just you have a high and

3201
02:21:56,230 --> 02:21:54,620
low within the prosperity gospel world

3202
02:21:58,841 --> 02:21:56,240
and you have some figures who are

3203
02:22:00,581 --> 02:21:58,851
responsible like a TG Jakes and some who

3204
02:22:02,440 --> 02:22:00,591
are not like a CREP low dollar so you

3205
02:22:04,301 --> 02:22:02,450
you have to you have to do your shopping

3206
02:22:07,390 --> 02:22:04,311
for religious figures very carefully

3207
02:22:08,890 --> 02:22:07,400
where can everybody get the new book the

3208
02:22:11,470 --> 02:22:08,900
new book is called the miracle Club it

3209
02:22:13,480 --> 02:22:11,480
comes out October 16th you can pre-order

3210
02:22:18,251 --> 02:22:13,490
it wherever you buy books it's going to

3211
02:22:21,041 --> 02:22:18,261
be on digital physical and audio I've

3212
02:22:23,410 --> 02:22:21,051
got the advance copy everybody and I

3213
02:22:26,430 --> 02:22:23,420
have read through it the book is

3214
02:22:29,530 --> 02:22:26,440
seriously really good and I can't

3215
02:22:32,440 --> 02:22:29,540
express enough Mitch that when we talk

3216
02:22:34,480 --> 02:22:32,450
about the power of mind and the changing

3217
02:22:36,400 --> 02:22:34,490
of your own reality and the decisions

3218
02:22:38,380 --> 02:22:36,410
that you can make and change your own

3219
02:22:41,200 --> 02:22:38,390
life these are real

3220
02:22:42,639 --> 02:22:41,210
you know they are real yeah it's the

3221
02:22:44,349 --> 02:22:42,649
most concrete book I've ever written the

3222
02:22:46,630 --> 02:22:44,359
miracle club was my opportunity to

3223
02:22:48,160 --> 02:22:46,640
really come clean with people about the

3224
02:22:51,370 --> 02:22:48,170
philosophies and the techniques that I

3225
02:22:53,620 --> 02:22:51,380
personally follow now really quick you

3226
02:22:55,389 --> 02:22:53,630
know throw a freebie out there and I

3227
02:22:58,179 --> 02:22:55,399
will practice it myself

3228
02:23:00,550 --> 02:22:58,189
oh absolutely for anybody out there that

3229
02:23:02,979 --> 02:23:00,560
that wants to start making these changes

3230
02:23:06,160 --> 02:23:02,989
what you know what's a simple effective

3231
02:23:08,710 --> 02:23:06,170
tool that they could start with today

3232
02:23:10,870 --> 02:23:08,720
here's a really basic tool and a really

3233
02:23:13,479 --> 02:23:10,880
simple tool but it only works if you

3234
02:23:15,939 --> 02:23:13,489
throw yourself into a total passion come

3235
02:23:17,830 --> 02:23:15,949
up with what your definite chief aim is

3236
02:23:20,080 --> 02:23:17,840
in life and mean it and be absolutely

3237
02:23:23,260 --> 02:23:20,090
mature and serious and impassioned about

3238
02:23:24,969 --> 02:23:23,270
it spend time on it ask yourself if a

3239
02:23:28,030 --> 02:23:24,979
genie came to you and said I'm gonna

3240
02:23:29,349 --> 02:23:28,040
grant you a single wish but only on the

3241
02:23:31,899 --> 02:23:29,359
grounds that you tell me the absolute

3242
02:23:33,490 --> 02:23:31,909
truth or you'll lose everything how

3243
02:23:35,290 --> 02:23:33,500
would you respond to that would you be

3244
02:23:37,559 --> 02:23:35,300
able to respond to it because having one

3245
02:23:40,300 --> 02:23:37,569
definite chief aim is an engine of

3246
02:23:42,340 --> 02:23:40,310
tremendous progress in your life don't

3247
02:23:44,769 --> 02:23:42,350
underestimate it it's the closest thing

3248
02:23:47,170 --> 02:23:44,779
that we are given to a kind of magic

3249
02:23:48,880 --> 02:23:47,180
elixir and most people don't do it they

3250
02:23:51,010 --> 02:23:48,890
water down their aims they convince

3251
02:23:54,309 --> 02:23:51,020
themselves they can't have or don't have

3252
02:23:56,950 --> 02:23:54,319
one aim come up with one aim and see

3253
02:24:00,280 --> 02:23:56,960
what happens the finding your bliss is

3254
02:24:02,790 --> 02:24:00,290
an extraordinary thing and when you know

3255
02:24:06,460 --> 02:24:02,800
people find themselves and not only

3256
02:24:09,550 --> 02:24:06,470
maybe unhappy or maybe sick all the time

3257
02:24:13,210 --> 02:24:09,560
or just argumentative you know it's not

3258
02:24:15,519 --> 02:24:13,220
about these other things that are around

3259
02:24:18,820 --> 02:24:15,529
you it's because you you're not happy

3260
02:24:21,700 --> 02:24:18,830
you've gotten your bliss you know

3261
02:24:24,639 --> 02:24:21,710
nothing is I think a greater tonic to

3262
02:24:27,939 --> 02:24:24,649
living than a sense of purpose a sense

3263
02:24:30,460 --> 02:24:27,949
of being adrift a feeling of ennui a

3264
02:24:32,439 --> 02:24:30,470
feeling of not knowing what you're

3265
02:24:34,719 --> 02:24:32,449
seeking to accomplish on a given day

3266
02:24:36,399 --> 02:24:34,729
that's unbearable and we cover it up

3267
02:24:38,830 --> 02:24:36,409
with entertainment we cover it up with

3268
02:24:40,450 --> 02:24:38,840
booze and things like that but having a

3269
02:24:43,090 --> 02:24:40,460
sense of what you really want to get

3270
02:24:45,219 --> 02:24:43,100
done is it's an extraordinary tonic to

3271
02:24:47,349 --> 02:24:45,229
living yeah no doubt I can't wait to

3272
02:24:48,761 --> 02:24:47,359
come and hang out with you when you get

3273
02:24:54,761 --> 02:24:48,771
here Los Angeles

3274
02:24:59,530 --> 02:24:54,771
one last one last question ET lands at

3275
02:25:02,620 --> 02:24:59,540
your house yeah and says dude come with

3276
02:25:04,600 --> 02:25:02,630
us do you get on the ship wow what a

3277
02:25:06,730 --> 02:25:04,610
great question the answer is yes I

3278
02:25:09,820 --> 02:25:06,740
couldn't live with myself I couldn't

3279
02:25:13,120 --> 02:25:09,830
live with myself if I if I hadn't taken

3280
02:25:15,070 --> 02:25:13,130
that that step into the unknown I I

3281
02:25:17,410 --> 02:25:15,080
think that the only thing that scares me

3282
02:25:18,790 --> 02:25:17,420
is the absence of an unknown I I would

3283
02:25:20,530 --> 02:25:18,800
be frightened but I would have to say

3284
02:25:22,180 --> 02:25:20,540
yes because nothing is more frightening

3285
02:25:25,470 --> 02:25:22,190
to me than the absence of the unknown

3286
02:25:27,520 --> 02:25:25,480
see I told everybody you were one of us

3287
02:25:29,620 --> 02:25:27,530
thank you so much man what a great

3288
02:25:31,841 --> 02:25:29,630
conversation now one we've got to get

3289
02:25:34,330 --> 02:25:31,851
you back and once you love to hang out

3290
02:25:36,370 --> 02:25:34,340
with us do some tarot readings love it

3291
02:25:39,190 --> 02:25:36,380
we didn't discuss the Illuminati we

3292
02:25:41,830 --> 02:25:39,200
didn't go into a true occult history

3293
02:25:43,000 --> 02:25:41,840
going back to Egypt and and I know that

3294
02:25:45,131 --> 02:25:43,010
these are things that you're passionate

3295
02:25:47,350 --> 02:25:45,141
about and we'll do it all at another

3296
02:25:49,060 --> 02:25:47,360
time that's great thank you so much

3297
02:25:50,770 --> 02:25:49,070
enjoy the rest of your night out there

3298
02:25:52,690 --> 02:25:50,780
in New York Thank You Mitch great

3299
02:25:55,330 --> 02:25:52,700
evening enjoy - thank you absolutely

3300
02:25:58,540 --> 02:25:55,340
wonderful conversation and it is Mitch

3301
02:26:00,730 --> 02:25:58,550
Horowitz dot-com all of his books are

3302
02:26:02,680 --> 02:26:00,740
there he's got some great videos too as

3303
02:26:04,211 --> 02:26:02,690
well and you can go and check it out the

3304
02:26:06,990 --> 02:26:04,221
links are at Jimmy Church radio.com

3305
02:26:09,940 --> 02:26:07,000
Thank You Mitch have a great thank you a

3306
02:26:12,190 --> 02:26:09,950
great conversation this is fade to black

3307
02:26:13,870 --> 02:26:12,200
I'm gonna take a quick right and when I

3308
02:26:17,620 --> 02:26:13,880
come back I'll go ahead and open up the

3309
02:26:24,030 --> 02:26:17,630
phone lines Mitch Horowitz calm

3310
02:26:41,440 --> 02:26:38,220
[Music]

3311
02:26:42,070 --> 02:26:41,450
and you are listening to my boy Jimmy

3312
02:26:50,620 --> 02:26:42,080
Church

3313
02:27:01,801 --> 02:26:50,630
opinion reading a book will not make you

3314
02:27:04,390 --> 02:27:01,811
smarter hurricanes earthquakes wildfires

3315
02:27:06,970 --> 02:27:04,400
this year we've experienced more than

3316
02:27:09,220 --> 02:27:06,980
our fair share this is Jimmy Church of

3317
02:27:11,470 --> 02:27:09,230
fade to black and last month I decided

3318
02:27:13,900 --> 02:27:11,480
to make sure my family does not have to

3319
02:27:17,051 --> 02:27:13,910
worry about food should we get caught in

3320
02:27:17,620 --> 02:27:17,061
a real emergency situation introducing

3321
02:27:19,720 --> 02:27:17,630
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3322
02:27:21,850 --> 02:27:19,730
a healthy storable product that tastes

3323
02:27:23,650 --> 02:27:21,860
so good that you'll want to eat it every

3324
02:27:26,110 --> 02:27:23,660
day instead of just during those times

3325
02:27:29,501 --> 02:27:26,120
of duress all new manna products have a

3326
02:27:32,440 --> 02:27:29,511
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3327
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3328
02:27:36,370 --> 02:27:34,580
with the new manna pack in your home

3329
02:27:39,160 --> 02:27:36,380
you'll be able to sleep at night knowing

3330
02:27:42,070 --> 02:27:39,170
that you protected your family not only

3331
02:27:44,470 --> 02:27:42,080
have I tasted and tested I own it

3332
02:27:46,211 --> 02:27:44,480
now you can too just click on the new

3333
02:27:48,520 --> 02:27:46,221
manna banner on Jimmy Church radio.com

3334
02:27:50,980 --> 02:27:48,530
and use the promo code Jimmy when you

3335
02:27:52,660 --> 02:27:50,990
order in addition to a discount we'll

3336
02:27:53,620 --> 02:27:52,670
send you an autograph fade to black

3337
02:27:57,640 --> 02:27:53,630
t-shirt

3338
02:27:59,650 --> 02:27:57,650
seriously gobekli tepe this is Jimmy

3339
02:28:02,711 --> 02:27:59,660
Church of fade to black and I take life

3340
02:28:05,921 --> 02:28:02,721
change tea supplements every single day

3341
02:28:11,171 --> 02:28:05,931
it's what I do click on their banner ad

3342
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Jimmy Church radio.com when you take the

3343
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of indonesian and african mixed in and

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then roast it to the dark side of fade

3346
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3351
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the alchemy of masterful roasting and

3352
02:28:43,660 --> 02:28:40,100
smoking the beans is in every sip of

3353
02:28:46,660 --> 02:28:43,670
this full-bodied dark Java I need my

3354
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coffee dog deep with distinct

3355
02:28:51,700 --> 02:28:48,529
bittersweet chocolate highlights just

3356
02:28:54,130 --> 02:28:51,710
like the bunker leaning further into the

3357
02:28:57,399 --> 02:28:54,140
darkness of the roast is fade to black

3358
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blend from river moon coffee just click

3359
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on the banner at Jimmy Church radio.com

3360
02:29:07,290 --> 02:29:02,390
and use the promo code F to B blend for

3361
02:29:10,540 --> 02:29:07,300
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3362
02:29:12,399 --> 02:29:10,550
hi folks CBD is the home run hitter for

3363
02:29:13,510 --> 02:29:12,409
health right now why do you ask because

3364
02:29:16,240 --> 02:29:13,520
of what it does for the body

3365
02:29:18,429 --> 02:29:16,250
unfortunately I can't tell you all about

3366
02:29:20,290 --> 02:29:18,439
the benefit you know there's reasons do

3367
02:29:21,729 --> 02:29:20,300
your due diligence and log on to ancient

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3369
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3372
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3373
02:29:36,870 --> 02:29:33,949
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3374
02:29:39,189 --> 02:29:36,880
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3375
02:29:42,280 --> 02:29:39,199
this is Jimmy Church of fade to black

3376
02:29:45,700 --> 02:29:42,290
and my family is safe because of new

3377
02:29:47,800 --> 02:29:45,710
manna emergency food storage just go to

3378
02:29:53,710 --> 02:29:47,810
the new manna banner at Jimmy Church

3379
02:29:56,439 --> 02:29:53,720
radio.com promo code jimmy 10 are you

3380
02:29:58,960 --> 02:29:56,449
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3381
02:30:01,929 --> 02:29:58,970
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02:30:04,149 --> 02:30:01,939
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3386
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3387
02:30:15,760 --> 02:30:14,239
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3388
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3389
02:30:29,040 --> 02:30:18,770
now the paranormal radio app free in

3390
02:30:42,399 --> 02:30:32,769
it's not a lifestyle we chose we were

3391
02:30:48,350 --> 02:30:42,409
born this way Katie are a radio.com this

3392
02:30:48,360 --> 02:30:59,940
[Music]

3393
02:31:06,240 --> 02:31:03,040
welcome back to fade to black I'm you

3394
02:31:09,280 --> 02:31:06,250
know send me Church Mitch Horowitz

3395
02:31:12,070 --> 02:31:09,290
incredible conversation and just head

3396
02:31:14,110 --> 02:31:12,080
over to Mitch Horowitz calm the links

3397
02:31:16,930 --> 02:31:14,120
are over at Jimmy Church radio calm and

3398
02:31:19,750 --> 02:31:16,940
he's got some great videos up there as

3399
02:31:22,090 --> 02:31:19,760
well as all of his books and you've got

3400
02:31:23,650 --> 02:31:22,100
to go and check Mitch out and if you're

3401
02:31:26,500 --> 02:31:23,660
gonna be in Los Angeles he's gonna be

3402
02:31:29,830 --> 02:31:26,510
doing five different engagements over a

3403
02:31:33,310 --> 02:31:29,840
three or four days and just go to his

3404
02:31:35,590 --> 02:31:33,320
Twitter feed at Mitch Horowitz it's

3405
02:31:38,500 --> 02:31:35,600
right there and and come and hang out

3406
02:31:41,560 --> 02:31:38,510
we're definitely gonna make our way over

3407
02:31:45,160 --> 02:31:41,570
to hang out with Mitch when it gets here

3408
02:31:47,080 --> 02:31:45,170
later on in October and with that I've

3409
02:31:49,390 --> 02:31:47,090
got the phone lines open and if you're

3410
02:31:51,370 --> 02:31:49,400
on hold I'll get to you three to three

3411
02:31:54,460 --> 02:31:51,380
eight two five five zero four or five or

3412
02:31:58,330 --> 02:31:54,470
three two three seven two seven five

3413
02:32:00,850 --> 02:31:58,340
nine six nine five or eight one eight

3414
02:32:03,670 --> 02:32:00,860
nine two one six nine to nine okay and

3415
02:32:09,370 --> 02:32:03,680
I'll get to that in just a second also

3416
02:32:12,000 --> 02:32:09,380
I've got a new TV series that it's

3417
02:32:15,370 --> 02:32:12,010
freaking me out ins blowing my mind and

3418
02:32:21,700 --> 02:32:15,380
it's called maniac and it stars Emma

3419
02:32:26,830 --> 02:32:21,710
Stone and and Jonah Hill now don't don't

3420
02:32:29,440 --> 02:32:26,840
let the title of this series keep you

3421
02:32:35,080 --> 02:32:29,450
from checking it out it's called maniac

3422
02:32:38,050 --> 02:32:35,090
and the you know me I'm all about the

3423
02:32:40,780 --> 02:32:38,060
visuals the editing the production I've

3424
02:32:45,100 --> 02:32:40,790
got very very high standards when it

3425
02:32:47,170 --> 02:32:45,110
comes to stuff that that I watch and of

3426
02:32:49,840 --> 02:32:47,180
course the script and the story come

3427
02:32:52,630 --> 02:32:49,850
into play here but it's it's got to be

3428
02:32:58,840 --> 02:32:52,640
visually there too as well

3429
02:33:00,580 --> 02:32:58,850
this series is insane and what they have

3430
02:33:04,590 --> 02:33:00,590
done now you're gonna go check it out

3431
02:33:06,940 --> 02:33:04,600
you need to it's on Netflix and the

3432
02:33:11,260 --> 02:33:06,950
first episode I'm not gonna give

3433
02:33:13,450 --> 02:33:11,270
anything away but the first episode and

3434
02:33:16,130 --> 02:33:13,460
then and then it goes

3435
02:33:20,150 --> 02:33:16,140
backwards but anyway the first episode

3436
02:33:22,970 --> 02:33:20,160
will flip you out and lay things out for

3437
02:33:26,360 --> 02:33:22,980
you in a correct way and then now look

3438
02:33:28,850 --> 02:33:26,370
I'm only a few episodes in okay I don't

3439
02:33:31,520 --> 02:33:28,860
have the time to binge like I need to on

3440
02:33:34,540 --> 02:33:31,530
this on this series but I'm telling you

3441
02:33:38,690 --> 02:33:34,550
right now maniac

3442
02:33:43,730 --> 02:33:38,700
okay maniac I Netflix go and check it

3443
02:33:46,130 --> 02:33:43,740
out absolutely insane insane insane it

3444
02:33:47,900 --> 02:33:46,140
is that good not good let's go to the

3445
02:33:51,470 --> 02:33:47,910
phones hi you're live on fade to black

3446
02:33:54,830 --> 02:33:51,480
who's calling Deb from Sacramento hi Deb

3447
02:33:57,200 --> 02:33:54,840
how are you good Jimmy good show tonight

3448
02:33:59,270 --> 02:33:57,210
hey I heard you say earlier that I

3449
02:34:02,960 --> 02:33:59,280
thought you said you said you were five

3450
02:34:04,460 --> 02:34:02,970
six when I don't think you're talking

3451
02:34:10,690 --> 02:34:04,470
about your height when you guys were

3452
02:34:15,920 --> 02:34:13,130
and that's getting that's getting ahead

3453
02:34:20,180 --> 02:34:15,930
of myself a little bit I won't be my

3454
02:34:22,070 --> 02:34:20,190
birthday's not for two weeks okay for

3455
02:34:24,290 --> 02:34:22,080
some reason I thought you said five six

3456
02:34:28,460 --> 02:34:24,300
and I thought that's weird cuz I thought

3457
02:34:31,160 --> 02:34:28,470
he was 54 so that it right now I'll be

3458
02:34:34,180 --> 02:34:31,170
50 I'll be 55 in in a couple of weeks

3459
02:34:39,400 --> 02:34:34,190
and so there you go but thank you for

3460
02:34:42,620 --> 02:34:39,410
pointing have you see me happy belated

3461
02:34:45,020 --> 02:34:42,630
we'll get to that it's everybody knows

3462
02:34:48,650 --> 02:34:45,030
October 10th no big deal have you seen

3463
02:34:49,910 --> 02:34:48,660
maniac have you seen this new show no

3464
02:34:51,830 --> 02:34:49,920
but I'm gonna check it out because

3465
02:34:54,200 --> 02:34:51,840
usually when you recommend something and

3466
02:34:56,150 --> 02:34:54,210
I watch it it's like yep I'm glad I went

3467
02:34:59,301 --> 02:34:56,160
and did that this is one of those things

3468
02:35:04,820 --> 02:34:59,311
this is one of those okay look this is

3469
02:35:07,280 --> 02:35:04,830
the deal this is you need you need to

3470
02:35:10,520 --> 02:35:07,290
bring your intellect okay you got to

3471
02:35:13,370 --> 02:35:10,530
bring that that this is not a fluff

3472
02:35:15,170 --> 02:35:13,380
thing okay this is something else this

3473
02:35:18,560 --> 02:35:15,180
is you know this is some serious you've

3474
02:35:21,350 --> 02:35:18,570
got to to focus and concentrate but out

3475
02:35:22,900 --> 02:35:21,360
of the gate and you know it in in like

3476
02:35:26,309 --> 02:35:22,910
three minutes four minutes five minutes

3477
02:35:29,340 --> 02:35:26,319
that visually it's stunning there

3478
02:35:32,399 --> 02:35:29,350
editing production thought everything is

3479
02:35:35,309 --> 02:35:32,409
is in this right this is like a serious

3480
02:35:38,040 --> 02:35:35,319
thing and and by the time you get done

3481
02:35:41,579 --> 02:35:38,050
with the first episode you're like okay

3482
02:35:43,679 --> 02:35:41,589
alright the this is this is correct this

3483
02:35:47,359 --> 02:35:43,689
is well done so I'm just telling you the

3484
02:35:50,760 --> 02:35:47,369
name maniac is like why did they do that

3485
02:35:54,479 --> 02:35:50,770
because it has nothing to do with this

3486
02:35:56,069 --> 02:35:54,489
is not some slash or crazy no no this is

3487
02:35:58,949 --> 02:35:56,079
there's something else going on here but

3488
02:36:02,819 --> 02:35:58,959
anyway I've always enjoyed Emma Stone

3489
02:36:04,739 --> 02:36:02,829
and she's just great in this and it's

3490
02:36:08,869 --> 02:36:04,749
it's and then see this is the other

3491
02:36:13,109 --> 02:36:08,879
thing you go Jonah Hill right oh man why

3492
02:36:16,739 --> 02:36:13,119
okay but no no no no no no no no they

3493
02:36:21,300 --> 02:36:16,749
just just just get ready to go it's

3494
02:36:23,489 --> 02:36:21,310
really well done okay okay okay I want

3495
02:36:25,380 --> 02:36:23,499
to let you know well before I let you

3496
02:36:27,119 --> 02:36:25,390
know I got a hold of my pilot friend

3497
02:36:29,279 --> 02:36:27,129
again oh yeah we can actually I did

3498
02:36:30,659 --> 02:36:29,289
before I actually did last week after we

3499
02:36:32,340 --> 02:36:30,669
talked and I kept trying to get through

3500
02:36:34,949 --> 02:36:32,350
Fator night and I couldn't belong the

3501
02:36:37,380 --> 02:36:34,959
lines were crazy but before I go there

3502
02:36:39,090 --> 02:36:37,390
you mentioned Jacques Vallee before and

3503
02:36:41,040 --> 02:36:39,100
so I researched him I had heard the name

3504
02:36:43,760 --> 02:36:41,050
and I looked up and when you look at him

3505
02:36:47,279 --> 02:36:43,770
in his eyes he looks like if you go to

3506
02:36:50,189 --> 02:36:47,289
the movie et that commercial for it or

3507
02:36:52,590 --> 02:36:50,199
whatever and you look at et's eyes you

3508
02:37:01,079 --> 02:36:52,600
know the kids version of ET he looks

3509
02:37:06,719 --> 02:37:01,089
just like shocks away it's crazy-looking

3510
02:37:08,340 --> 02:37:06,729
well there is okay we'll get back to

3511
02:37:10,710 --> 02:37:08,350
that in a second I don't want this to

3512
02:37:14,010 --> 02:37:10,720
get away from me Gabriel Byrne is in

3513
02:37:18,000 --> 02:37:14,020
this series Sally Field is in the series

3514
02:37:20,340 --> 02:37:18,010
and Justin Theroux one of my favorite

3515
02:37:22,019 --> 02:37:20,350
actors out there you know Gabriel Byrne

3516
02:37:25,050 --> 02:37:22,029
right one of the greatest ever that has

3517
02:37:27,540 --> 02:37:25,060
ever graced any screen but that's the

3518
02:37:30,510 --> 02:37:27,550
level of what is happening here but

3519
02:37:34,109 --> 02:37:30,520
Justin Theroux just just amazing Sally

3520
02:37:35,699 --> 02:37:34,119
Field right I mean how so everybody just

3521
02:37:39,250 --> 02:37:35,709
needs to go and check this out there's a

3522
02:37:44,739 --> 02:37:39,260
very very amazing series maniac

3523
02:37:46,660 --> 02:37:44,749
now back to jock Valley there is okay

3524
02:37:50,260 --> 02:37:46,670
there everybody's listening live right

3525
02:37:55,029 --> 02:37:50,270
now but for those that are gonna listen

3526
02:37:58,599 --> 02:37:55,039
later in in the archives Jacques Vallee

3527
02:38:03,790 --> 02:37:58,609
made a series of interviews now I

3528
02:38:08,109 --> 02:38:03,800
believe it was with a university out of

3529
02:38:11,529 --> 02:38:08,119
San Francisco in the 80s and it looks

3530
02:38:14,950 --> 02:38:11,539
like so just go and and and check this

3531
02:38:19,479 --> 02:38:14,960
out and it was with I want to say the

3532
02:38:21,040 --> 02:38:19,489
professor's name was dr. love LOV e

3533
02:38:24,370 --> 02:38:21,050
again I could be wrong

3534
02:38:26,849 --> 02:38:24,380
I've watched him so many times but go

3535
02:38:31,120 --> 02:38:26,859
back and watch these and it's almost

3536
02:38:34,149 --> 02:38:31,130
public access television so you've got a

3537
02:38:37,750 --> 02:38:34,159
couple of chairs with a plant in the

3538
02:38:40,960 --> 02:38:37,760
middle right just see you know stuff in

3539
02:38:43,029 --> 02:38:40,970
the background no set no nothing and it

3540
02:38:45,779 --> 02:38:43,039
looks like public access television

3541
02:38:49,120 --> 02:38:45,789
which it might have been I'm not so sure

3542
02:38:52,410 --> 02:38:49,130
but go back and there's a series and I

3543
02:38:55,660 --> 02:38:52,420
think they did probably six or ten

3544
02:38:57,399 --> 02:38:55,670
episodes we'll go back and watch these

3545
02:38:59,859 --> 02:38:57,409
first off the questions are really good

3546
02:39:03,040 --> 02:38:59,869
and dr. love whatever his name is is

3547
02:39:05,200 --> 02:39:03,050
really really really good but that's not

3548
02:39:07,179 --> 02:39:05,210
the point and you need to go watch it

3549
02:39:10,719 --> 02:39:07,189
because of Jacques Vallee and they're

3550
02:39:14,290 --> 02:39:10,729
incredible but the camera catches

3551
02:39:18,069 --> 02:39:14,300
Jacques in in these close-ups and you

3552
02:39:21,489 --> 02:39:18,079
get a chance to look in his eyes and so

3553
02:39:25,080 --> 02:39:21,499
when I say today that he's an et right

3554
02:39:28,870 --> 02:39:25,090
and I say it in jest I got all of that

3555
02:39:30,609 --> 02:39:28,880
from that public access interview series

3556
02:39:35,679 --> 02:39:30,619
that they did in the 80s and this is

3557
02:39:38,710 --> 02:39:35,689
probably 81 82 83 go and watch those

3558
02:39:43,479 --> 02:39:38,720
it's an incredible series and and go and

3559
02:39:45,429 --> 02:39:43,489
watch that and and don't tell me that

3560
02:39:48,489 --> 02:39:45,439
he's not an et because you can't do it

3561
02:39:50,529 --> 02:39:48,499
because he is and I said it to Jacque I

3562
02:39:52,150 --> 02:39:50,539
said it to him I wait you know I had an

3563
02:39:54,820 --> 02:39:52,160
opportunity to hang out with him

3564
02:39:56,860 --> 02:39:54,830
couple of times at contact in the desert

3565
02:39:59,261 --> 02:39:56,870
a couple of years ago and I asked him

3566
02:40:01,900 --> 02:39:59,271
about those series and I told him about

3567
02:40:05,261 --> 02:40:01,910
his eyes back then and he just laughed

3568
02:40:08,560 --> 02:40:05,271
about it but if you get a chance just go

3569
02:40:11,290 --> 02:40:08,570
and and and seek out that series that

3570
02:40:13,841 --> 02:40:11,300
that he did back then in the 80s okay so

3571
02:40:23,850 --> 02:40:13,851
well yeah what would you think about

3572
02:40:26,650 --> 02:40:23,860
Barry Barry Horowitz Barry Horowitz

3573
02:40:29,801 --> 02:40:26,660
Mitch Horowitz would you think about

3574
02:40:35,051 --> 02:40:29,811
that a view uh followed Mitch in the

3575
02:40:36,850 --> 02:40:35,061
past I've never heard of him I haven't

3576
02:40:38,980 --> 02:40:36,860
and so I'm going to check out his

3577
02:40:40,420 --> 02:40:38,990
website because you know if he does

3578
02:40:42,761 --> 02:40:40,430
readings and all that stuff that really

3579
02:40:44,560 --> 02:40:42,771
interests me and I'm not I've never

3580
02:40:46,150 --> 02:40:44,570
really been into the tarot cards either

3581
02:40:47,381 --> 02:40:46,160
so everything you guys are talking about

3582
02:40:49,900 --> 02:40:47,391
was I was just trying to pay attention

3583
02:40:51,610 --> 02:40:49,910
and visualize everything you guys are

3584
02:40:54,790 --> 02:40:51,620
talking about because yeah I've never

3585
02:40:56,591 --> 02:40:54,800
been into Tarot so just kind of

3586
02:40:58,390 --> 02:40:56,601
listening trying to learn you know what

3587
02:41:00,551 --> 02:40:58,400
y'all are talking about all right so we

3588
02:41:03,520 --> 02:41:00,561
got all of that out of the way what's up

3589
02:41:05,350 --> 02:41:03,530
with your pilot friend okay so do you

3590
02:41:07,780 --> 02:41:05,360
going back to the conversation we had

3591
02:41:10,330 --> 02:41:07,790
last week where he basically suggested

3592
02:41:12,160 --> 02:41:10,340
you know that if they're turning off

3593
02:41:14,830 --> 02:41:12,170
telescopes it's because they don't want

3594
02:41:16,660 --> 02:41:14,840
us to see what's up there and what if

3595
02:41:18,940 --> 02:41:16,670
the technology went down and then we'd

3596
02:41:20,740 --> 02:41:18,950
be able to see stuff so I grilled him

3597
02:41:22,210 --> 02:41:20,750
for like half an hour I'm amazed you

3598
02:41:25,420 --> 02:41:22,220
know that he put up with it and finally

3599
02:41:27,160 --> 02:41:25,430
he said okay Debbie he says everyone you

3600
02:41:29,140 --> 02:41:27,170
know who's into this stuff believes

3601
02:41:31,570 --> 02:41:29,150
there's a sacred space for us it's

3602
02:41:33,370 --> 02:41:31,580
pretty widely known out there he says am

3603
02:41:36,430 --> 02:41:33,380
i implying that there's something to

3604
02:41:38,381 --> 02:41:36,440
keep us from seeing it yes I am implying

3605
02:41:40,660 --> 02:41:38,391
that and then he said so if you want to

3606
02:41:42,940 --> 02:41:40,670
talk conspiracy I said well no this

3607
02:41:44,620 --> 02:41:42,950
isn't a conspiracy topic he goes well

3608
02:41:46,150 --> 02:41:44,630
let me just add something under this

3609
02:41:48,850 --> 02:41:46,160
because we just had an anniversary of

3610
02:41:51,631 --> 02:41:48,860
9/11 he says and as a pilot I can tell

3611
02:41:54,520 --> 02:41:51,641
you a steel plane cannot penetrate

3612
02:41:56,801 --> 02:41:54,530
between towers and it's just amazing to

3613
02:41:59,950 --> 02:41:56,811
me how gullible and stupid the public is

3614
02:42:01,390 --> 02:41:59,960
just because they see it on TV he says

3615
02:42:04,180 --> 02:42:01,400
and that's all I'm gonna say about that

3616
02:42:05,860 --> 02:42:04,190
one too and I'm like no you can't just

3617
02:42:07,270 --> 02:42:05,870
say that and he goes well you know

3618
02:42:09,280 --> 02:42:07,280
seen all the stuff on YouTube you've

3619
02:42:11,470 --> 02:42:09,290
done the research he goes keep just keep

3620
02:42:13,570 --> 02:42:11,480
research and goes I don't have all the

3621
02:42:16,030 --> 02:42:13,580
answers I don't know he goes I just know

3622
02:42:18,370 --> 02:42:16,040
the pilot never heard of a plane that

3623
02:42:22,930 --> 02:42:18,380
can penetrate between towers he says

3624
02:42:26,320 --> 02:42:22,940
it's just it's ridiculous wait a minute

3625
02:42:28,960 --> 02:42:26,330
here yeah we don't even understand what

3626
02:42:31,841 --> 02:42:28,970
he's suggesting what does he suggest you

3627
02:42:33,970 --> 02:42:31,851
be suggesting that a plane the material

3628
02:42:37,750 --> 02:42:33,980
in the way a plane is built is not

3629
02:42:39,280 --> 02:42:37,760
strong enough to fly into the building

3630
02:42:41,980 --> 02:42:39,290
if you look at the videos it looks like

3631
02:42:43,720 --> 02:42:41,990
it's just cut through those towers like

3632
02:42:45,700 --> 02:42:43,730
butter it just slicing isn't a wing

3633
02:42:47,620 --> 02:42:45,710
would break off something would break it

3634
02:42:51,700 --> 02:42:47,630
wouldn't just glide right into it and

3635
02:42:53,591 --> 02:42:51,710
then explode the way it did and he goes

3636
02:42:56,020 --> 02:42:53,601
look at the videos look at what you're

3637
02:42:57,940 --> 02:42:56,030
looking at he says you know I just he

3638
02:42:59,770 --> 02:42:57,950
says it's just an audible what do you

3639
02:43:02,230 --> 02:42:59,780
think it was good I don't know what it

3640
02:43:04,360 --> 02:43:02,240
was he goes maybe it was you know he

3641
02:43:07,120 --> 02:43:04,370
goes I can't elaborate cuz I don't know

3642
02:43:09,370 --> 02:43:07,130
he goes but you know maybe it was a

3643
02:43:10,841 --> 02:43:09,380
drone with a wings on it I don't know

3644
02:43:13,780 --> 02:43:10,851
what they built what they put in those

3645
02:43:15,370 --> 02:43:13,790
towers he says but I just you know the

3646
02:43:18,190 --> 02:43:15,380
whole collapsing the whole bitty so the

3647
02:43:20,261 --> 02:43:18,200
system all bullcrap he says if you want

3648
02:43:21,730 --> 02:43:20,271
to you know talk about can I said I

3649
02:43:22,950 --> 02:43:21,740
don't want to talk about conspiracy I

3650
02:43:25,390 --> 02:43:22,960
want to hear what you're saying you know

3651
02:43:27,430 --> 02:43:25,400
right he was employing the Strongs not

3652
02:43:29,950 --> 02:43:27,440
using please tell me flout saying a

3653
02:43:32,530 --> 02:43:29,960
plane is not strong enough to go through

3654
02:43:35,801 --> 02:43:32,540
a building to penetrate a building like

3655
02:43:38,110 --> 02:43:35,811
that a commercial airliner is not strong

3656
02:43:39,880 --> 02:43:38,120
enough to do that he says he goes go to

3657
02:43:41,980 --> 02:43:39,890
youtube and look at the way the planes

3658
02:43:44,680 --> 02:43:41,990
crash on the ground how they fall apart

3659
02:43:47,051 --> 02:43:44,690
and you're going to tell me that a plane

3660
02:43:50,200 --> 02:43:47,061
was able to just go through the building

3661
02:43:52,480 --> 02:43:50,210
like that without breaking apart many

3662
02:43:54,610 --> 02:43:52,490
ways in fact until it gets in there and

3663
02:43:58,690 --> 02:43:54,620
then it blows up because come on you

3664
02:44:01,170 --> 02:43:58,700
know well Deb all of that is interesting

3665
02:44:04,600 --> 02:44:01,180
to think about but then there's the

3666
02:44:08,650 --> 02:44:04,610
simple question of physics and weight

3667
02:44:10,450 --> 02:44:08,660
ratios in that if you have and I'm going

3668
02:44:14,230 --> 02:44:10,460
to talk something very basic and very

3669
02:44:16,360 --> 02:44:14,240
simple but if you have a car and you're

3670
02:44:20,051 --> 02:44:16,370
in a parking lot and

3671
02:44:24,640 --> 02:44:20,061
you're driving at two miles an hour and

3672
02:44:28,600 --> 02:44:24,650
you hit a pole you may not damage the

3673
02:44:31,470 --> 02:44:28,610
car you hit that pole at fifty miles an

3674
02:44:34,990 --> 02:44:31,480
hour and there's going to be some damage

3675
02:44:43,630 --> 02:44:35,000
now if you have something that is a

3676
02:44:45,011 --> 02:44:43,640
movable object let's say you set up it

3677
02:44:47,261 --> 02:44:45,021
doesn't even matter

3678
02:44:49,720 --> 02:44:47,271
something light that that can move a

3679
02:44:52,301 --> 02:44:49,730
bicycle a baseball bat you base it you

3680
02:44:54,220 --> 02:44:52,311
set it up on the and you hit that at one

3681
02:44:57,640 --> 02:44:54,230
mile an hour it just falls over but if

3682
02:44:59,980 --> 02:44:57,650
you hit that at 50 miles an hour or 100

3683
02:45:03,400 --> 02:44:59,990
miles an hour you've got something that

3684
02:45:07,660 --> 02:45:03,410
cannot normally damage a car creating

3685
02:45:10,180 --> 02:45:07,670
extreme damage and it's and now if we're

3686
02:45:12,280 --> 02:45:10,190
talking about 200 miles an hour 250

3687
02:45:15,820 --> 02:45:12,290
miles an hour this plane that normally

3688
02:45:18,580 --> 02:45:15,830
right would crumple when it hits

3689
02:45:20,320 --> 02:45:18,590
something but you're you're now going at

3690
02:45:22,330 --> 02:45:20,330
that kind of force going into the side

3691
02:45:27,220 --> 02:45:22,340
of the Benny you know I don't know I

3692
02:45:30,430 --> 02:45:27,230
don't it's I don't know kinetic energy

3693
02:45:34,180 --> 02:45:30,440
at those speeds can cause a lot of

3694
02:45:36,610 --> 02:45:34,190
damage that's that's just me I don't

3695
02:45:39,490 --> 02:45:36,620
know I don't know the the Pentagon the

3696
02:45:41,170 --> 02:45:39,500
other well well the Pentagon on the

3697
02:45:43,240 --> 02:45:41,180
other hand where there isn't any wing

3698
02:45:46,330 --> 02:45:43,250
marks on the sides of the hole or

3699
02:45:51,250 --> 02:45:46,340
nothing really obviously out there where

3700
02:45:53,680 --> 02:45:51,260
I that I question what what the issues

3701
02:45:55,480 --> 02:45:53,690
are there but you know I really don't

3702
02:45:58,841 --> 02:45:55,490
know but when we're talking about the

3703
02:46:00,360 --> 02:45:58,851
side of the of the World Trade Center if

3704
02:46:04,630 --> 02:46:00,370
we're getting into something else

3705
02:46:06,580 --> 02:46:04,640
conceptually a hologram or some other

3706
02:46:09,070 --> 02:46:06,590
type of plane made out of another type

3707
02:46:11,220 --> 02:46:09,080
of material which this pilot is

3708
02:46:13,930 --> 02:46:11,230
suggesting I don't know we're getting

3709
02:46:15,970 --> 02:46:13,940
we're getting way out there in

3710
02:46:18,730 --> 02:46:15,980
conspiracy theories unless he knows

3711
02:46:21,280 --> 02:46:18,740
something that we don't but I don't know

3712
02:46:22,930 --> 02:46:21,290
to me yeah well and the other point he

3713
02:46:27,220 --> 02:46:22,940
brought up to me and I asked him because

3714
02:46:28,841 --> 02:46:27,230
I had just gone back on 9/11 the fact it

3715
02:46:30,230 --> 02:46:28,851
was the night of it was one of these

3716
02:46:31,970 --> 02:46:30,240
nights recently

3717
02:46:34,490 --> 02:46:31,980
and Mike Beres name came up and I

3718
02:46:35,780 --> 02:46:34,500
remember something coming up where one

3719
02:46:37,640 --> 02:46:35,790
time I heard you guys say just don't

3720
02:46:40,790 --> 02:46:37,650
talk about 9/11 so I went back and I

3721
02:46:42,680 --> 02:46:40,800
found the anniversary episode from 2014

3722
02:46:44,540 --> 02:46:42,690
a fade to black or Mike be recalled in

3723
02:46:46,370 --> 02:46:44,550
the show and he went at it with your

3724
02:46:48,320 --> 02:46:46,380
callers and so I listened to that whole

3725
02:46:50,570 --> 02:46:48,330
thing and I listened to it before I

3726
02:46:52,520 --> 02:46:50,580
talked to my friend and I brought up the

3727
02:46:55,580 --> 02:46:52,530
topic that some of the guys were saying

3728
02:46:57,921 --> 02:46:55,590
about the error ratio and being that low

3729
02:46:59,900 --> 02:46:57,931
in the air and at the plan that the

3730
02:47:01,370 --> 02:46:59,910
plane wouldn't be able to even fly that

3731
02:47:03,890 --> 02:47:01,380
low and I asked him about that because

3732
02:47:05,240 --> 02:47:03,900
it's absolutely right because it would

3733
02:47:07,160 --> 02:47:05,250
have gone down it couldn't have

3734
02:47:09,080 --> 02:47:07,170
maintained it I go what about coming

3735
02:47:11,600 --> 02:47:09,090
from up high and then diving down

3736
02:47:13,640 --> 02:47:11,610
because there's no way a pilot would be

3737
02:47:15,470 --> 02:47:13,650
able to do that it goes even if it was

3738
02:47:17,301 --> 02:47:15,480
remotely controlled the plane was

3739
02:47:19,490 --> 02:47:17,311
remotely controlled and it was precise

3740
02:47:21,650 --> 02:47:19,500
flying because the engines aren't built

3741
02:47:24,711 --> 02:47:21,660
that way weren't being able to maintain

3742
02:47:26,360 --> 02:47:24,721
that kind of airspeed at that low of an

3743
02:47:28,640 --> 02:47:26,370
altitude and go through the building

3744
02:47:30,801 --> 02:47:28,650
what he said he and he believes that so

3745
02:47:32,211 --> 02:47:30,811
again you know who knows he says I mean

3746
02:47:33,860 --> 02:47:32,221
I don't know this is just what I know

3747
02:47:35,600 --> 02:47:33,870
from being a pilot all these years and

3748
02:47:37,940 --> 02:47:35,610
what I understand he goes that this

3749
02:47:40,100 --> 02:47:37,950
advanced craft or something crazy that

3750
02:47:42,620 --> 02:47:40,110
they used then they managed it somehow

3751
02:47:44,720 --> 02:47:42,630
but I know from my experience you're

3752
02:47:46,671 --> 02:47:44,730
saying that just he was pretty open to

3753
02:47:48,890 --> 02:47:46,681
talking about 9/11 because it's been so

3754
02:47:51,140 --> 02:47:48,900
long no what about I want to go back to

3755
02:47:54,650 --> 02:47:51,150
this space force

3756
02:47:56,540 --> 02:47:54,660
what were his comments on that okay so

3757
02:47:58,461 --> 02:47:56,550
comments from that were you know I think

3758
02:47:59,631 --> 02:47:58,471
everyone generally now that Trump's

3759
02:48:02,600 --> 02:47:59,641
coming out and saying there's going to

3760
02:48:05,360 --> 02:48:02,610
be a space for us he says I think the

3761
02:48:07,551 --> 02:48:05,370
general consensus is if it were divulge

3762
02:48:10,011 --> 02:48:07,561
there's a there's a secret you know

3763
02:48:11,780 --> 02:48:10,021
technology space force that we've had

3764
02:48:13,730 --> 02:48:11,790
for years he says which you're always

3765
02:48:15,470 --> 02:48:13,740
talking about it goes I don't think it

3766
02:48:17,360 --> 02:48:15,480
would be that wild to suppose of that

3767
02:48:20,120 --> 02:48:17,370
stuff exists so let's just say that that

3768
02:48:22,490 --> 02:48:20,130
generally exists he says then yeah is

3769
02:48:24,560 --> 02:48:22,500
there stuff up there protecting you know

3770
02:48:26,330 --> 02:48:24,570
and I keep saying the word protecting

3771
02:48:29,720 --> 02:48:26,340
that's the wrong one keeping us from

3772
02:48:31,520 --> 02:48:29,730
seeing it technology goes then yeah

3773
02:48:33,921 --> 02:48:31,530
there isn't something in place keeping

3774
02:48:36,261 --> 02:48:33,931
the Earth from seeing it sure if it's up

3775
02:48:38,120 --> 02:48:36,271
there I said well are you verifying that

3776
02:48:39,740 --> 02:48:38,130
it's up there he says yeah that's the

3777
02:48:41,870 --> 02:48:39,750
kind of thing you know that you have to

3778
02:48:43,370 --> 02:48:41,880
suppose a few do you believe it exists I

3779
02:48:43,910 --> 02:48:43,380
said yeah I believe there's advanced

3780
02:48:46,250 --> 02:48:43,920
technology

3781
02:48:49,850 --> 02:48:46,260
a little there you go he says it's not

3782
02:48:51,620 --> 02:48:49,860
impossible to imagine that exists if it

3783
02:48:53,690 --> 02:48:51,630
exists and they don't want us to see it

3784
02:48:56,540 --> 02:48:53,700
then there's going to be something in

3785
02:48:59,420 --> 02:48:56,550
place for that yeah and so he kind of

3786
02:49:01,490 --> 02:48:59,430
admitted it without you know it was his

3787
02:49:03,890 --> 02:49:01,500
way of confirming it without saying yeah

3788
02:49:07,160 --> 02:49:03,900
I'm absolutely sure of it or I'm saying

3789
02:49:10,160 --> 02:49:07,170
yes but it was a generalization of you

3790
02:49:12,560 --> 02:49:10,170
know say well you know but it's not it's

3791
02:49:14,390 --> 02:49:12,570
not ridiculous to assume that that's in

3792
02:49:17,840 --> 02:49:14,400
place and that it does exist

3793
02:49:20,990 --> 02:49:17,850
yeah today I did earlier today I did an

3794
02:49:23,570 --> 02:49:21,000
interview with ransom Godwin who went up

3795
02:49:25,160 --> 02:49:23,580
and shot that video at the solar

3796
02:49:28,190 --> 02:49:25,170
observatory I don't know if it's gotten

3797
02:49:30,800 --> 02:49:28,200
posted yet but but I'd and in that

3798
02:49:34,420 --> 02:49:30,810
conversation I had with him today

3799
02:49:39,980 --> 02:49:34,430
there's one there's one point that I

3800
02:49:45,410 --> 02:49:39,990
just can't get my head around and that

3801
02:49:48,200 --> 02:49:45,420
is the evacuation the uprooting of

3802
02:49:51,590 --> 02:49:48,210
families and employees vacating

3803
02:49:53,630 --> 02:49:51,600
everything forcing them to leave not

3804
02:49:55,940 --> 02:49:53,640
telling the law enforcement what is

3805
02:50:00,560 --> 02:49:55,950
going on putting up police tape across

3806
02:50:06,200 --> 02:50:00,570
their house right boarding houses and

3807
02:50:10,160 --> 02:50:06,210
then allowing ransom and others to go up

3808
02:50:13,730 --> 02:50:10,170
there walk around videotape but wait a

3809
02:50:16,429 --> 02:50:13,740
minute they just evacuated right and now

3810
02:50:18,020 --> 02:50:16,439
they're allowing anybody to just go up

3811
02:50:20,179 --> 02:50:18,030
there and to videotape the sheriff

3812
02:50:22,429 --> 02:50:20,189
didn't stop anybody they didn't have any

3813
02:50:24,530 --> 02:50:22,439
security up there but it was important

3814
02:50:27,350 --> 02:50:24,540
enough to evacuate everybody to get out

3815
02:50:32,770 --> 02:50:27,360
of there and this is that there's that

3816
02:50:37,370 --> 02:50:32,780
but that apparently they want us to

3817
02:50:42,400 --> 02:50:37,380
believe that it was child pornography

3818
02:50:44,960 --> 02:50:42,410
now when when I take that as a whole

3819
02:50:48,260 --> 02:50:44,970
right and I just look at the whole big

3820
02:50:54,110 --> 02:50:48,270
picture and that child pornography the

3821
02:50:54,720 --> 02:50:54,120
FBI that is why the the University that

3822
02:50:57,541 --> 02:50:54,730
runs the

3823
02:51:01,140 --> 02:50:57,551
program up there aura thought that it

3824
02:51:03,780 --> 02:51:01,150
was so important that child pornography

3825
02:51:06,121 --> 02:51:03,790
was a threat which it is but a physical

3826
02:51:08,940 --> 02:51:06,131
threat that you have to bring in the FBI

3827
02:51:12,770 --> 02:51:08,950
Blackhawk helicopters evacuate the

3828
02:51:15,871 --> 02:51:12,780
entire place and and board up windows

3829
02:51:21,150 --> 02:51:15,881
because not know that in its child

3830
02:51:23,820 --> 02:51:21,160
pornography something that something is

3831
02:51:26,610 --> 02:51:23,830
not right yeah something is not real

3832
02:51:30,091 --> 02:51:26,620
something is not ready but and and the

3833
02:51:33,541 --> 02:51:30,101
media was all into this story when it

3834
02:51:35,461 --> 02:51:33,551
was aliens and an evacuation and a

3835
02:51:38,551 --> 02:51:35,471
security risk and nobody's talking about

3836
02:51:41,761 --> 02:51:38,561
it so that deserved media coverage and

3837
02:51:44,581 --> 02:51:41,771
and everybody covered it but as soon as

3838
02:51:46,261 --> 02:51:44,591
the child pornography issue was brought

3839
02:51:51,180 --> 02:51:46,271
up it's a non-issue

3840
02:51:53,701 --> 02:51:51,190
and and ransom told me today that CNN

3841
02:51:58,621 --> 02:51:53,711
called him for an interview okay

3842
02:52:00,451 --> 02:51:58,631
and yeah and an hour later the press

3843
02:52:03,511 --> 02:52:00,461
release comes out that is child

3844
02:52:07,381 --> 02:52:03,521
pornography and CNN called him back and

3845
02:52:09,060 --> 02:52:07,391
said it's a non-story we're not gonna

3846
02:52:12,331 --> 02:52:09,070
interview you and it's like wait a

3847
02:52:16,020 --> 02:52:12,341
minute now if you want to squash the

3848
02:52:18,121 --> 02:52:16,030
story make it child pornography nobody's

3849
02:52:20,280 --> 02:52:18,131
been arrested by the way I thought that

3850
02:52:22,020 --> 02:52:20,290
the last time that anybody was ever

3851
02:52:24,240 --> 02:52:22,030
accused of child pornography they're

3852
02:52:26,640 --> 02:52:24,250
immediately in jail the computers are

3853
02:52:29,490 --> 02:52:26,650
seized and charges are brought forward

3854
02:52:32,581 --> 02:52:29,500
and everybody is involved here IP

3855
02:52:35,911 --> 02:52:32,591
addresses or chase down and all of this

3856
02:52:40,411 --> 02:52:35,921
you know none of that has happened right

3857
02:52:42,810 --> 02:52:40,421
but now CNN has made it a non-story and

3858
02:52:47,100 --> 02:52:42,820
that's what they told they literally

3859
02:52:50,610 --> 02:52:47,110
told them it's a it's done so how

3860
02:52:53,761 --> 02:52:50,620
successful is that to squash the reasons

3861
02:52:56,730 --> 02:52:53,771
for this evacuation you know and it is

3862
02:52:59,430 --> 02:52:56,740
it's it's mind-blowing to me I cannot

3863
02:53:02,371 --> 02:52:59,440
get my my head around this but nobody

3864
02:53:04,650 --> 02:53:02,381
wants to talk we do it yes flip the

3865
02:53:07,770 --> 02:53:04,660
script on people yes and nobody wants to

3866
02:53:08,911 --> 02:53:07,780
nobody wants to talk about it now I am

3867
02:53:14,640 --> 02:53:08,921
blown

3868
02:53:16,261 --> 02:53:14,650
have members in this community that want

3869
02:53:18,780 --> 02:53:16,271
to get to the bottom of the story and

3870
02:53:22,081 --> 02:53:18,790
they will they're not gonna just just

3871
02:53:24,871 --> 02:53:22,091
because the government wants to just

3872
02:53:27,211 --> 02:53:24,881
have this all go away that it does I

3873
02:53:30,001 --> 02:53:27,221
don't think it will and I think that we

3874
02:53:32,490 --> 02:53:30,011
will find out exactly what what happened

3875
02:53:34,440 --> 02:53:32,500
up there this is so the movie contact

3876
02:53:39,301 --> 02:53:34,450
it's not even funny

3877
02:53:41,610 --> 02:53:39,311
you know I knew I knew Deb that when

3878
02:53:43,261 --> 02:53:41,620
when a situation like this was going to

3879
02:53:45,091 --> 02:53:43,271
arise and I'm talking about a radio

3880
02:53:47,640 --> 02:53:45,101
telescope an observatory

3881
02:53:49,740 --> 02:53:47,650
something like this goes down and the

3882
02:53:52,051 --> 02:53:49,750
man comes in and shuts down everything

3883
02:53:56,881 --> 02:53:52,061
that this is how the story would play

3884
02:53:58,980 --> 02:53:56,891
out and it did it's so textbook you know

3885
02:54:02,161 --> 02:53:58,990
and and we've got to get to the bottom

3886
02:54:05,970 --> 02:54:02,171
of it I I don't want to let this go I I

3887
02:54:07,950 --> 02:54:05,980
really really don't there's something

3888
02:54:08,911 --> 02:54:07,960
happened we're not gonna let it go you

3889
02:54:10,860 --> 02:54:08,921
know it's funny you keep mentioning

3890
02:54:12,180 --> 02:54:10,870
contact us on my favorite movie so I

3891
02:54:14,700 --> 02:54:12,190
always notice when it's on TV and

3892
02:54:16,680 --> 02:54:14,710
they've been airing it like three or

3893
02:54:18,091 --> 02:54:16,690
four days out of the week through last

3894
02:54:20,761 --> 02:54:18,101
week through this week and they just

3895
02:54:22,560 --> 02:54:20,771
keep showing it over and over on one of

3896
02:54:24,360 --> 02:54:22,570
the main cable stations it's almost like

3897
02:54:27,001 --> 02:54:24,370
they just want to put in your face and

3898
02:54:28,381 --> 02:54:27,011
make you think yeah yeah yeah they

3899
02:54:30,570 --> 02:54:28,391
always say when the Illuminati does

3900
02:54:32,011 --> 02:54:30,580
something the rules are that David

3901
02:54:33,180 --> 02:54:32,021
Wilcock talks about it that when they do

3902
02:54:34,921 --> 02:54:33,190
it they hit one of the rules is they

3903
02:54:36,900 --> 02:54:34,931
have to show you what they're doing but

3904
02:54:38,251 --> 02:54:36,910
not tell you but show you in a way or

3905
02:54:42,211 --> 02:54:38,261
put messages out there and they keep

3906
02:54:46,261 --> 02:54:42,221
showing that movie they wanted this is

3907
02:54:49,501 --> 02:54:46,271
this is this is I think the point that

3908
02:54:53,161 --> 02:54:49,511
is is so important they wanted somebody

3909
02:54:58,501 --> 02:54:53,171
like ransom to go up on that hill to

3910
02:55:02,011 --> 02:54:58,511
videotape to see that x-files DVD and to

3911
02:55:04,831 --> 02:55:02,021
to get this story out they that that's

3912
02:55:07,770 --> 02:55:04,841
what they wanted they wanted people

3913
02:55:10,621 --> 02:55:07,780
across that police tape they wanted this

3914
02:55:12,091 --> 02:55:10,631
evacuation and the FBI and the Solar

3915
02:55:14,251 --> 02:55:12,101
Observatory and the Black Hawk

3916
02:55:17,041 --> 02:55:14,261
helicopters and the silence and the

3917
02:55:19,860 --> 02:55:17,051
security issues to get out as a story

3918
02:55:21,620 --> 02:55:19,870
and they were successful in that why

3919
02:55:25,040 --> 02:55:21,630
have an X file

3920
02:55:27,110 --> 02:55:25,050
DVD on a compound that was evacuated and

3921
02:55:28,940 --> 02:55:27,120
the windows boarded up and sanitized and

3922
02:55:30,620 --> 02:55:28,950
clean and mopped everything that they

3923
02:55:32,480 --> 02:55:30,630
did up there but they turn around and

3924
02:55:34,700 --> 02:55:32,490
leave an x-files DVD at the top of the

3925
02:55:37,190 --> 02:55:34,710
trash can at the window where

3926
02:55:39,889 --> 02:55:37,200
everybody's gonna look in and see it

3927
02:55:41,630 --> 02:55:39,899
it's like come on you know and that's

3928
02:55:44,990 --> 02:55:41,640
exactly how it played out

3929
02:55:46,340 --> 02:55:45,000
all right Deb thank you so much and I'll

3930
02:55:47,690 --> 02:55:46,350
see you tomorrow night on the show

3931
02:55:50,090 --> 02:55:47,700
always a great phone call

3932
02:55:52,490 --> 02:55:50,100
absolutely hey real quick tucker carlson

3933
02:55:54,110 --> 02:55:52,500
just covered this again last friday

3934
02:55:56,030 --> 02:55:54,120
talked about the story need to throw the

3935
02:55:57,710 --> 02:55:56,040
pedophilia in and he was questioning all

3936
02:55:59,480 --> 02:55:57,720
of it and saying we're going to get to

3937
02:56:01,940 --> 02:55:59,490
the bottom of this this story isn't over

3938
02:56:04,219 --> 02:56:01,950
and he had just broadcast it after last

3939
02:56:04,760 --> 02:56:04,229
Thursday's show so hopefully he won't

3940
02:56:06,770 --> 02:56:04,770
drop it

3941
02:56:11,840 --> 02:56:06,780
yeah maybe I got to get Tucker on this

3942
02:56:14,630 --> 02:56:11,850
show that's that's not about it thank

3943
02:56:15,889 --> 02:56:14,640
you so much Deb good night can I do me

3944
02:56:20,929 --> 02:56:15,899
thank you take my call

3945
02:56:23,900 --> 02:56:20,939
thank you I the the situation up in the

3946
02:56:27,500 --> 02:56:23,910
National Solar Observatory I cannot

3947
02:56:29,810 --> 02:56:27,510
believe it happened just like it did I

3948
02:56:32,600 --> 02:56:29,820
mean just spot on the money all the way

3949
02:56:36,110 --> 02:56:32,610
down it's it's an unbelievable situation

3950
02:56:38,030 --> 02:56:36,120
to me you know evacuating the compound

3951
02:56:39,860 --> 02:56:38,040
boarding up windows putting up please

3952
02:56:42,560 --> 02:56:39,870
tape and they're not having security

3953
02:56:44,240 --> 02:56:42,570
there the sheriff doesn't stop ransom or

3954
02:56:46,520 --> 02:56:44,250
anybody else he turns around in his car

3955
02:56:50,450 --> 02:56:46,530
he allows video tape to go up there and

3956
02:56:53,389 --> 02:56:50,460
and everything played out like it did

3957
02:56:55,340 --> 02:56:53,399
and ransom walks up with his son looks

3958
02:56:57,410 --> 02:56:55,350
in the window and there's an x-files DVD

3959
02:57:00,590 --> 02:56:57,420
in the top of the trash can now they

3960
02:57:03,469 --> 02:57:00,600
wanted that that part of the story to

3961
02:57:05,660 --> 02:57:03,479
get out it's exactly what they wanted to

3962
02:57:08,900 --> 02:57:05,670
have happen and in the end after

3963
02:57:12,260 --> 02:57:08,910
everything goes down they want to say it

3964
02:57:15,800 --> 02:57:12,270
was child pornography and the Wi-Fi

3965
02:57:18,530 --> 02:57:15,810
network no I'm just I'm I'm not I'm not

3966
02:57:21,530 --> 02:57:18,540
buying it and we've got to this this

3967
02:57:25,400 --> 02:57:21,540
this community of ours has got to stay

3968
02:57:29,330 --> 02:57:25,410
part of stay a part of the story we have

3969
02:57:32,179 --> 02:57:29,340
to it's just the way that it is I've got

3970
02:57:34,479 --> 02:57:32,189
to thank Mitch Horowitz what an amazing

3971
02:57:36,579 --> 02:57:34,489
conversation tonight it is Mitch

3972
02:57:38,920 --> 02:57:36,589
whit's dot-com and he's going to be out

3973
02:57:41,619 --> 02:57:38,930
here in Los Angeles at the end of

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02:57:43,329 --> 02:57:41,629
October so go over to his Twitter feed

3975
02:57:45,880 --> 02:57:43,339
I'll get everything out over the next

3976
02:57:47,710 --> 02:57:45,890
few days too as well where he is going

3977
02:57:49,239 --> 02:57:47,720
to be speaking and we're gonna be there

3978
02:57:51,519 --> 02:57:49,249
so come and hang out with all of us

3979
02:57:53,469 --> 02:57:51,529
tomorrow night John

3980
02:57:57,969 --> 02:57:53,479
Greenwald right here the black vault

3981
02:58:00,939 --> 02:57:57,979
we've got some the only Freedom of

3982
02:58:02,979 --> 02:58:00,949
Information Act document to be released

3983
02:58:05,439 --> 02:58:02,989
on a tip we're gonna discuss that

3984
02:58:08,619 --> 02:58:05,449
tomorrow night all of his documents that

3985
02:58:12,159 --> 02:58:08,629
just revealed that he found on the Japan

3986
02:58:13,630 --> 02:58:12,169
Airlines UFO incident up in Alaska all

3987
02:58:14,319 --> 02:58:13,640
of that tomorrow night right here on

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02:58:16,689 --> 02:58:14,329
fade to black

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02:58:18,969 --> 02:58:16,699
theta blacks executive producers Riddick

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02:58:21,010 --> 02:58:18,979
Emory on shows produced by Hill J palm

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02:58:24,489 --> 02:58:21,020
Rene Dennis and Bob announces our Steve

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02:58:27,939 --> 02:58:24,499
harder Jean Patou mrdiko Vaz webmaster

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02:58:32,079 --> 02:58:27,949
drew the geek music doug aldrich intro

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02:58:33,249 --> 02:58:32,089
space boys space boy music calm beta

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02:58:39,789 --> 02:58:33,259
blackness produced by kjsurya

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02:58:41,979 --> 02:58:39,799
productions kedi ra the planet podcast

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02:58:43,689 --> 02:58:41,989
own a copyright of 2018 by fade to black

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02:58:46,059 --> 02:58:43,699
in the game changer network

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02:58:48,579 --> 02:58:46,069
it cannot be rebroadcast download a copy

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02:58:50,739 --> 02:58:48,589
to use anyone the known universe without

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02:58:51,130 --> 02:58:50,749
written permission from fade to black of

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02:58:53,760 --> 02:58:51,140
the game

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02:58:56,530 --> 02:58:53,770
changer Network our meals Jimmy Church

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02:58:59,050 --> 02:58:56,540
follow me on Twitter I J Church radio

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02:59:00,189 --> 02:58:59,060
I'll see everybody tomorrow night right

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02:59:04,479 --> 02:59:00,199
here on fade to black

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02:59:07,760 --> 02:59:04,489
until then everybody be safe go back